With support ending for Windows 10, the most popular desktop operating system in the world currently, possibly 240 million pcs may be sent to the landfill. This is mostly due to Windows 11’s exorbitant requirements. This will most likely result in many pcs being immediately outdated, and prone to viruses. GNU/Linux may be these computers’ only secure hope, what do you think?
…What does the writer think support end means? Microsoft bricks the PC as soon as the support period ends?
They’re going to just keep using Windows 10, security be damned. Probably a good number of users who weren’t keeping their PC up to date even when Microsoft was forcing updates on them.
I still see XP pcs in the wild sometimes
Lots of hospitals seem to be running XP
I work in the behavioral health field as an IT security admin and network with hospitals/health clinics all all the time. The amount of them using XP and 7 in some capacity should scare everyone. The other security admins know it’s an issue, but they just laugh it off.
I tell them if I were an immoral man, their company would be compromised just based off of that information.
Yeah I work for an emergency management SaaS company and we block outdated OSs and browsers and it’s wild how we will occasionally get pushback from potential new customers who are surprised we don’t support their outdated IT infrastructure due to the security risk
“what do you mean you don’t service tin cans on a string?!”
We have a piece of test equipment that runs windows 2000. It has to be quarantined on its own subnet isolated from the rest of the network.
Yep. Came across a computer recently still running Windows 2000 on it. Fan sounded like a truck with a bad lifter tick 😂
Looking forward to more, bigger ddos attacks with so many unsecured computers sitting around… :(
A ton of people can barely open a PDF and this sub thinks those people can change to a completely different operating system.
My 80 year old dad has been using a XUbuntu for years and never even noticed. The only reason he knows he’s using Linux at all is because he saw a news story about Windows tracking and asked about it. He was quite happy not to be affected.
We’re gonna pick them up secondhand
Damned right we are!
If you are so bad at using a computer you can’t open a PDF, then you won’t notice the difference between windows and linux
But a ton of people can open a PDF and will be able to select an USB stick from menu and click next, next, next… It’s not completely different, you still use a mouse, a keyboard, you click on things, you get some feedback from it… When a new kind of mobile app arrive, I can see someone using no more than 5 apps in life having problems, but this doesn’t mean only them exists, we do not talk about switching everyone here. People change houses, how are they figuring out where is the toilet if doors have different color and are in different positions?
Also a reason why any software like Microsoft Windows or Office should be banned from public education, especially primary schools.
What a dreamer
People aren’t going to throw the PCs out. They are going to continue using Windows 10 for years without security updates.
I still saw XP installs a decade after support had ended.
What if, sometime after Win 10 loses support a virus takes advantage of the lack of patches and propagates across all the machines with a simple message “This operating system is no longer supported, please click here to upgrade.” The button then runs a script to download and install a user friendly Linux distro. The world is then saved.
Make it install temple OS, so that it can save not only the planet but also our souls. Amen. 🙏🙏🙏🙏
My kind of hopes.
The problem is most people don’t have the technical ability or interest in switching to Linux. Here is the solution:
- We, as Linux users, must be better advocates for the platform to untechnical people.
- We should make ourselves available to help people make the transition.
The solution is donate them. Don’t send them to a landfill. Give poor students a free laptop with Linux installed, etc. There are probably thousands of uses for an old computer that are better than sending it to a landfill.
Make correct marketing,create tools which will user switch OS with one click,create tech support gor usual people with small prices
Marketing is monopolized with Google and Facebook. Manufacturers and Microsoft won’t make one-click installs happen. Tech support would be chicken and egg problem. Ugh…
Linux doesn’t support my DAW or audio interface. I’m not throwing away thousands of pounds of software and equipment to use Linux.
I would happily give it a go if cubase / uad interfaces were supported.
For me, it’s the lack of support for the audio HW. Infuriating.
Your DAW and audio interface doesn’t support Linux.*
Yeah, it’s a bummer, but you are in a small portion of effected computer users, still others can benefit from longer support.
None of the main adobe suite works on Linux either, so let’s not pretend my use case is so narrow. Literally none of the programs I use to work (Cubase, Audition, After Effects, Illustrator, Premiere, yes I can install a virtual windows machine but that completely defeats the purpose) works with Linux. And from what I gather last time I researched this, hardly any audio interfaces are Linux compatible. Most of the games I want to play also are not Linux-compatible.
Fact of the matter is, despite the large dedicated userbase (which I appreciate), it still has a giant gap where many prosumers and casual users cannot utilise it. It’s no good saying “ahhh well YOU’RE not compatible with US! No u!”. I’d love to switch and tbh am strongly considering a setup for live PA that’s Linux based, in the hope that it brings greater stability. But it’s going to be a large investment of time, and I’ll have to buy a different audio interface if I have a hope of making it work.
The Adobe case is a big one. For me, it’s lightroom that has no real Linux counterpart. The app itself isn’t where the magic is - darktable exists. The magic is in the interapp interoperability - bi-directional syncs and edits in any platform. FOSS is very unlikely to create something like this (would love to be wrong) as it’s less of a tech challenge than an enterprise architecture challenge with a component systems falling in line. This sort of thing requires money to be executed effectively, unfortunately.
Really hope overall user base in Linux can grow enough to catch attention of SW/HW manufacturers, but have been hoping this for many, many years…
And this is a huge barrier for a lot of users, a massive roadblock. But the article talk about houndres of millions of computers, my point was just about that even if millions like you cannot switch, still in this statistics are millions that can especially non-professional that do not make audio or video, but that are going to throw away a working machine.
I feel like you might feel being personally directed by my comment, because of your respond with “YOU’re not compatible”. Maybe it was bad wording, sorry. What I ment was that it can be frustrating to see “Linux doesn’t support …” when actually it has everything needed to support this software and the burden to make it available is on the software developer. Like saying that USB-C doesn’t support iPhone 13. Lack of it still hurts the Linux side anyway, but I just don’t want misconsaptions about which side should make a port happen.
Yep I definitely took it wrong, one of the problems with text only communication… No body language or audio cues! No worries.
The devs of my audio interface have definitely been asked a fair bit about Linux compatibility… But considering they’ve not even bothered bringing their new DAW to PC, it seems they’re strongly focussed on mac ecosystems only for the foreseeable.
Personally I think compatibility should be a two way street pun not intended! But unfortunately companies tend to vote with our wallets, so until Linux becomes even more established I doubt they will dedicate much if any resources to making their devices work on it. Shame.
I bought a new audio interface for live work a few months back, went for an audient id24 partly because it’s Linux compatible (although no native drivers). So I will get stuck in at some point. I started using PCs back when floppy disks were actually floppy so I’m not afraid of command line stuff!
For me, it’s not the DAW (Reaper works fine), but this is not the case for every DAW and it must be recognized that switching DAWs is non-trivial (nor should it be expected). In my case, it’s the HW. I can likely get my interface to run (unsupported) but my Maschine is a non-starter. Yes - I know there are a few drivers for similar HW around written by clever folk who’ve done reverse engineering, but it only covers a few minor use cases and is, at best a science experiment and not something one should ever depend on even if it did work.
SW is a problem too - yes most plugins can be coaxed into working, but certainly not all. Add to that the underlying tech is usually wine, and it’s a perpetual game of whackamole to maybe get the stuff you paid for to run.
The folks writing these bridging tools are not too blame - it’s brilliant, wonderful work. Fundamentally, it’s an act of good will that one can’t rely afford to fully depend on if it even does work. I love FOSS, but it’s not everything - I certainly don’t expect a free ride, but I do want the option to pay to run what I want.
The issue is the HW and SW manufacturers - they need a critical mass of potential users to be bothered to commit to developing for Linux. My hope is that as user bases grow (in places like India) the cost/benefit analysis shifts.
This is interesting and concerning… I don’t need a lot of plugins for live stuff, but I was definitely planning to use my Maschine!
So is that confirmed completely inoperable in Linux? No idea how I’d trigger parts without it.
I’d also bet that a huge portion of those offices rely on at least some kind of proprietary software that doesn’t play nice/officially support Linux. MS Office, for example, or Autodesk’s stuff. When I saw what a headache it would be to get these working on Linux, I just shrugged and decided I’d keep my dual boot available for when I inevitably have need.
You’re turning up the cost dial for every additional workaround or adjustment you ask of people. Just to save what is fundamentally seen as $50-200 up front cost on a system for a new Windows 11 Pro license.
The article and post title itself alludes to the fact that windows 11 won’t support millions of machines, so a w11 license is useless. And if you meant you can buy a PC that supports w11 and is worth using, for $50, I need to consult with you for the world’s best shopping tips
Tip 1: it’s free if you steal it.
Exactly. I tried using Linux and I just don’t understand how to use it, and I consider myself fairly tech savvy. It would bring my productivity to a grinding halt if I had to switch to Linux.
I’m like this with windows these days tbh
I get to the desktop and I’m like how the fuck do I even use this thing
Exactly. I’ve not used many Linux flavors that are as confusing as what they have done to windows since v7
There are many many outdated patterns how to do things in Windows that are cemented in public knowledge. Running random executable installers from the web giving them superuser permissions is I thing the most popular one.
How to share all user settings between system installations? How to change the logo in the desktop bar? How to add a directory to an applications bar? How to change system build-in keyboard shortcut? How to reinstall just the system keeping the programs? How to make a file run on a shortcut? Those are things I use daily, that are impossible or need some hacky programs to work on anything other than Linux, I would die if I had to switch back now.
Did you install gentoo or something? Zorin or Mint is just install and use it (just like Windows)
We all know that won’t happen because most users don’t give a shit about things like conserving hardware or the resources that went into making them, and will just use this as an excuse to splurge on the latest shiny device.
Fuck the users
Herein lies the rub where the discourse online always fails. It’s easy to blame the rich, corporations, politicians, etc. but the end of the day they’re simply doing what the masses want. We are the problem.
Now that said, I understand the appeal of blaming a smaller segment of the population because it’s easier to shift blame and it’s easier to force change that way, but rest assured Apple stops making a new phone every year their brand dies unless everyone stops doing it. They’re doing it because we are conditioned to want it.
We are the underlying problem. All of us.
Edit - having my point proven is amazing.
If you’re saying everyone is providing your point, I think you disproved your own point.
They’re doing it because we are conditioned to want it.
Conditioning a behavior is basic psych101. It’s a controlled external stimulus which illicits a desirable action from the subject. So a conditioned consumer is subject to external stimulie which illicits them to spend. I wouldn’t blame the subject here, I’d blame the one doing the conditioning.
Regardless of all that, you are right but so wrong. We are all to blame, but I mean corporations and us. Politicians and the oligarchs aren’t responsible for what you or I do. What they are responsible for is manipulating systems to benefit themselves over the interests of the general public.
Since politicians and the business elite wield so much influence that makes them more responsible than you or I who really can’t make a big difference on our own. You’re blaming the proletariat for being the proletariat, but we don’t choose whether or not we are. You can work as hard as you can your entire life and you’ll never amount to the level of power and influence Elon, Jeff, Mark, Bill, or Steve had/have.
Nah, that’s shit. We are not the problem. The people in this thread don’t seem to be the kind of people to go out and buy the latest device every 6 months. I keep my phones for years until either the performance or battery becomes nearly unusable for me. I install Linux on older hardware (and newer hardware) and buy new hardware when necessary, not every time it comes out.
You can blame the average person, sure, but saying all of us is just incorrect.
fuck me harder ms yes daddy yes please mmmm thats good keep going harder harder HARDER YES
fr tho, that ‘smaller segment of the population’ owns the means of production/computation. so yes, I do blame them. and so should you and anyone with more that a couple folds in their brain.
Nah I haven’t bought a new machine in years, sticking to the old school bro. But I get it, a lot of people who are gamers or streamers would definitely buy in and I get why too because so long as the internet speeds keep increasing, there will be more streamers for the next big game or influencer chit chat etc
Who the fuck throws out their computer when it’s still working???
A lot of businesses. I’ve stocked an entire network lab out of waste bins from buildings with tech companies in them. Laptops, monitors, network gear, cabling. I once scored a whole box of 100W USB-C chargers.
You could make a living reselling stuff online.
I’m sorry, 100W USB-C is throwaway stuff now? Wut?
Federal, state and local government , multinational companies and boomers.
Literally just talked to my mother-in-law who was talking about throwing out her laptop because Windows 10 is losing support and she can’t upgrade to Windows 11.
It would probably run linux perfectly.
But I would never put linux on it. I am not doing tech support for my MIL who just admitted to me that she “locked down her machine because she fixed the registry issues windows has and turned on ipv6 on her router” and alluded to changing other settings but she cant understand why her “wifi keeps dropping out” and thinks its because the neighbors installed a ring doorbell.
Except for that last part, sounds somewhat plausible…
Doorbell is wireless, from temu, and is missing FCC compliance sticker.
Just a hunch.
All of whom have processes software and employees who are not prepared to swap to Linux
State governments usually are required to place all of their computers up for sale through surplus. (Hard drives usually removed and destroyed). I have been through that process at a State College and a University. They aren’t just thrown away. I imagine there is a similar process for federal computer.
True they give it to “recyclers” who try to sell what they can and throw the rest. I know this because I used to work for the “recyclers”
Yeah, when access to raspberry pi’s and such was none existant I knew a few people who would pick up old Optiplex computers and such to use as media servers and such. Old dells used to be very reliable. Throw whatever distro on there gui or not, and the shitty graphics cards wouldn’t matter much
Linux users
Wat
It will be mostly Enterprise upgrading. The average consumer buys the cheapest laptop they can get. They won’t be upgrading. I think nowadays not many average consumers even use computers. They just do everything on a phone.
Most enterprise is going to continue to pay for extended windows 10 support especially for things like embedded control systems running windows 10 ltsc/iot.
It’s 50/50. The last Enterprise I worked at they would NEVER agree to pay that. They’d rather get new machines
Windows 11 won’t work on my laptop. Installed Linux a few weeks ago. Works better now than it did with Windows 10.
Although I’m not surprised, it is interesting that the same big tech companies like Apple and Microsoft taking stances on being “environmentally conscious” while also ignoring forced obsoletion of old hardware. Your average office environment just needs basic email, document/excel editing software and a browser. Now to continue to do these base functions, they have to buy new PCs to do the same exact thing. And it’s not even faster anymore due to the bloat.
If tech wants to preach about the environment, they best start figuring out ways to keep computers out of the landfills.
Or make repurposing a thing.
But buying new things is good for the economy!
(/s in case it’s needed)Was it EVER faster though? My experience with Windows has always been that they release new versions based on upcoming hardware specs and unless you spend top-dollar on the very latest hardware for their next release, you are going to see things moving slower on the new desktop. That’s one of things I’ve enjoyed about linux, you can pretty much always upgrade the OS on an older machine without concern of taking a hit on the performance, and sometimes you even get a boost.
Good for us. There will be a lot of cheap laptops on the market, which we can use for selfhosting and stuff.
>buy cheap laptop because "it broken no work ooha booga" >install Linux Mint on it >resell it at a higher price >profitI really want to know if someone with no experience on linux can use Vanilla OS without any trouble.
Maybe. Personally tho I would put them on Mint or Pop, maybe Fedora Silverblue
More computers for us poor folk!
Same here
Why not give the poor some of our old and used computers?
Cheaper laptops and old computers for everyone could start with switching to Linux
That’s the MS business model in partnership with PC makers. It’s a juggernaut. They’ve operationalized it.
Removed by mod
I’ll install linux on my gaming rig when w10 support ends, I hate w11
Why not try it now?
I did, discord was a mess (the systray icon not working and couldn’t stream audio), no parsec host support and other little things.
Yes, there are alternatives/workarounds but it’s too much of a hustle to play some games if the alternative is w10, I already know how to optimize it/solve common issues and for this specific case “it just works”
Do you mind me asking which Distro you had used? I recently switched from w10 and haven’t had any issues with discord or audio.
I tried Linux Mint, then I switched to Nobara and I had issues with discord in both, the systray icon not showing green when I was speaking/muted and I was unable to screen share a program with sound (then I looked up and found it’s a discord problem not giving a shit about linux users).
Then the gaming part was pretty messy, specially when I tried to run pirate games or games like league of legends, I spent 2 days trying to make league of legends work with lutris (i don’t play that game anymore so now it shouldn’t be a problem)
The funny thing is that I have a linux server on which I self host a lot of services and I’ve been tinkering with it for +4 years now, I’m pretty used to Debian and Fedora in the terminal, but when it comes to desktop I get lost pretty easily.
By the way, which distro do you use?
The discord thing is improving (slowly), also partly it now recognizes Linux games launched from steam, but not proton ones. I haven’t tried lutris or anything yet, but I haven’t booted into windows for weeks now.
I’ve also become more comfortable with Linux in general so that’s likely helped too.
I also have issues with Discord, they just don’t get the linux paradigm. Running it in a browser seems to work okay though (I use Firefox).
