Hi, Lemmy! So I made two mistakes. But I’d like to inform Lemmy, that there is a free speech version of the Lemmy code being used to throw racial slurs around. That instance is called goatpen.co I advise you not to go there, as you will come across racial slurs on the front page.
So my first mistake was asking what people on discussions.app like to use for different social networks. One instance, as mentioned above was goatpen.co. My curiousity got the better of me, and I went to check it out. That was my second mistake. That place is a cesspool.
That’s all I wanted to say. Someone or some company is using lemmy’s code to host a lemmy-clone and make it a cesspool.
Lemmy is open source, meaning that anyone can use it for whatever purpose they like. Realistically there is nothing we can do against that. The sooner we accept this reality, the better.
In my opinion, the main goal of Lemmy as a project is to challenge proprietary social media like Reddit. That wont be achievable if we try to exclude anyone from using Lemmy. Of course that doesnt mean that we have to agree with their opinions, and block tools exist exactly for this reason.
Also, I think if these extremists leave Reddit, that could eventually lead to their deradicalization. Reddit has no real incentive to deradicalize them, because more users and more activity means more ad money for them. But fediverse instances are usually run by volunteers in their free time, who have less incentive to permit such toxicity.
Realistically there is nothing we can do against that
except there are things you could do, if you were using an ethical open source license you’d be able to shut down goatpen.co without trouble
Just like a kitchen knife can be used by murderers does not mean that the kitchen knife manufacturer should actively monitor who is buying their knifes and go after the ones with bad intentions in my opinion. In the same way, I don’t think free software should be licensed under such an ethical open source license.
First of all, it’s just very hard to enforce I’d imagine. Would people who do not care about respecting human rights to begin with even care about such a license? You’re not stopping “evil” by making up rules that “evil” people don’t follow almost by definition. At least the license is more clear about what is considered as acceptable and what not unlike the infamous “The Software shall be used for Good, not Evil” clause, for which I have to give it some credit.
Everything you can make can be used for wrong things and I suppose you’ll have to accept that you’ll never have full control over that. The only thing that can stop something to be used by people with bad intentions is to never create it in the first place.
Besides, I´d rather have my enemy use open source software instead of closed source software. If they use open source software, it’s easier to get a grasp on what they’re capable of.
For software like Lemmy with federation, I’d just say to block those from federating to your own instances and stop giving those instances attention. As long as the flagship instances that federate with each other keep up a positive attitude, I would just ignore those extremist people’s instances
Just like a kitchen knife can be used by murderers does not mean that the kitchen knife manufacturer should actively monitor who is buying their knifes and go after the ones with bad intentions in my opinion
wrong
I’d just say to block those from federating to your own instances and stop giving those instances attention
that humanizes them, they’ll feel like “i’m not allowed there but at least i can exist”, which is a very dangerous precedent
Please tell me you’re a troll.
“At least I can exist” being “dangerous precedent” is low key advocating for genocide, btw.
Can you explain how we could practically ban kitchen knives from being bought by murders? Also, have you seen minority report?
Can you explain how we could practically ban kitchen knives from being bought by murders?
other, more progressive, countries have done it: https://www.gov.uk/buying-carrying-knives
Also, have you seen minority report?
i support minorities so i would never report them
i support minorities so i would never report them
ok that got a genuine chuckle out of me
you think it’s a joke? i’m out here fighting hate online by moderating reddit 10+ hours a day so people like you can have a nice environment
I died of laughter here. Thanks.
Could you elaborate with a reason or so for why they are wrong?
i do not engage in bad-faith discussion
I have an issue with the ethical open source license, this is irrespective of my stance on free software, which is being ethical is ambiguous, it depends on the reader or interpreter as to what ethical is.
For example I would consider being anti racist ethical but someone else could interpret being anti racist as racist ( or however they victimize themselves )
That ambiguity, that my stupid ass could come up with off the cuff, is why its a bad license to use.
How could anti-racism be racist? Sure you can have resentment and preconceived ideas about a person based on their skin color, but racism is far more than this. First because there’s cultural racism, too. Second, because racism is a structural oppression which distirbutes power and resources unequally: there is not a single place on Earth to my knowledge where white people are victims of structural racism.
there is not a single place on Earth to my knowledge where white people are victims of structural racism
South Africa, right now.
Attacking landowners to reclaim the resources and lands they stole from the people is not racism. Make equality (racial and economic) a reality and you’ll see there’s no such “racism”, but when the white 10% own over 50% of the resources in the country, and the State is bent on oppressing the poor (such as evicting squats/slums for the profit of big landlords) there’s bound to be a backlash.
It was only a matter of time before alt-right instances championing “free speech” started to pop out - this is the first one I hear about, I was expecting them to adopt Lemmy earlier
I mean, I guess it was inevitable? It’s just sad to see good code go to waste to the alt-right/neo-nazi subhumans
subhumans
This is exactly the language that fascists use, please dont copy their shitty ideas.
I could use scum or pieces of shit?
Also, the code doesnt “go to waste”. Any user less on corporate social media is a benefit for humanity.
Please consider to look at how federation and FOSS code/platforms work. I made a parent comment, and nutomic’s comment is also nice.
I see just an empty page saying the domain is registered.
It might be preview.goatpen.co
Oh ok, those posts are certainly bad
HOLY SHIT…I HAD A BRILLIANT IDEA! Since most free speech networks run on blockchain, and most of them aren’t moderated, if a user uses a racial slur, they LOSE bitcoin or crypto when they get downvoted. What do you think?
It is precisely because of censorship these people became further and further radicalized, without the opportunity for regular people to arrive at their new locations and tone it down a bit. Lemmy is making the right call to do nothing about this.
Lemmy is a federated FOSS forum-style social network. Anyone is free to create instances, and I knew one day this would happen.
Ideas are implemented using tools. Tools are not bad themselves, the ideas are depending on moral conscience, generally guided by a few set of rules like not letting people fall for vices of life (excess of anything, sex, drugs, gambling et al), or critical information that threatens their lives, or people being stopped from harassing or discriminating against others.
Avoid the instance like you do Gab or Parler or whatever the hell is out there. Internet is a virtual manifestation of the real world with a lot of pseudonymous and deanonymised creators and users. Learn to live with it. Improvise, adapt and overcome.
