Due to the recent ban of a wolfballs.com-user for “Bigotry and racism on his main account on Wolfball.” it is requested that Lemmy.ml updates the Code of Conduct to reflect actual moderation. Please consider adding that Lemmy.ml will ban users for comments made with other accounts on other instances.
The ban has been reverted.
Imagine if you will, you decided to have a neighbourhood block party. You say, this is an open and inviting space, and everyone is welcome!
So lots of different people show up, but a few of your guests are uncomfortable. You ask them what’s wrong, you want everyone to feel safe here.
They say, “that guy over there, he’s always saying things like we’re not really people, or we’re sick in the head, or we don’t deserve rights. He threatens us and talks gleefully about the day when we’ll finally be outlawed as degenerates because we’re queer and Black. He and his bigot buddies all talk about the Great Replacement, and how they can’t wait to rise up against the establishment in a war to put Trump back in power.”
And you know this is true. He doesn’t hide it. In fact, he’s mentioned those hangouts at your barbeque, and said that everyone at the barbeque is also welcome to join them for those hangouts.
But instead you say, “Yeah, but he hasn’t said those horrible things here. So you should just chill out, it would be wrong for me to kick him out of this party just because when he’s not at this party he doesn’t believe you’re human. That’s an important part of everyone feeling welcome and safe here. Do you get it? Do you feel safe around him now?”
That’s why someone who comes on here, a Leftist instance, and who has, through their own volition, outed themselves as the bigoted wolfballs admin account, should, in fact, be banned. To do otherwise is to just prop up bigots as long as they know when to “mask on.”
It’s not like you should be hunting for everyone’s other platform activity, but he provided links to that content himself. He promoted that alt-right shithole right here on lemmy.ml. He took his own mask off, and it’s pretty gross not to ban him.
The point is that lemmy.ml rules only apply on this instance. Otherwise we admins would be forced to go through Reddit profiles of all users to search for potential rule violations.
Where do you find any of this? I checked the frontpage of wolfballs just now, and couldnt find a single post about LGBT. So if you want me to take this seriously, you should give some actual examples. Even so, if there are a couple of users with such opinions it doesnt mean the admin shares those views. There are also plenty of users on lemmy.ml which I disagree with.
MasterofBalls in particular has written code for Lemmy, and runs one of the most active instances. For me that means he is a valuable contributor to the project, even if I dont necessarily agree with his political views. Excluding him from project discussions would only harm the project.
Finally, you are not even a lemmy.ml user. If it bothers you so much, ask your own admins to ban the user. lemmy.ml moderation isnt really your concern.
"How do you define a women
A women is defined as x chromosomes and no tallywhacker i.e probably not you"
There’s fucking anti LGBTQ shit right in the goddamn sidebar, please learn to read and realize how gross you are defending this piece of shit. If you read the shit he posts himself it is racist, anti-LGBTQ (he calls literally all queers groomers) and yes, he personally believes in Great Replacement. Like what is wrong with you? Is anyone on Lemmy.ml actually a fucking leftist???
EDIT: And again how is promoting wolfballs on lemmy.ml not a violation of lemm.ml’s rules? are you actually saying it is okay to promote bigoted websites on lemm.ml and you still claim lemmy.ml is anti-bigotry and leftist? like really?
deleted by creator
“If you define it as white people being replaced in white nations there’s no denying it’s real”
“I’m not anti-immigration at all just anti-replacement”
“I have two children . . . I’m hoping to get three so at least we get above replacement levels.”
Nope, just your normal not believing in replacement kind of guy says this stuff huh
deleted by creator
Man, you are like a beacon of red flags.
More like a bunch of red flags with a white circle and some strange interwined crosses…
this you bruh?
“A mudblood is someone who’s blood has been tainted by the experimental covid vaccines. A pure blood is someone who has pure human dna or worded a different way, someone who has never received a covid vaccine.” - wolfballs-dot-com
what.
How is this still up? Obvious troll/ bait!
Thank you for being one of the most sane mods/Admins/devs ive seen in any community for quite some time. Many others would just say ‘fuck you what I say goes’ or just cave to the guilt tripping but the Lemmy devs really seem to have their heads scdewerd on straight.
Thanks for the support!
The developers ability to focus on long term goals for the project is the reason NRSK believes in Lemmy, and tries to support it as a platform in any way possible.
And what if some anarchists here were uncomfortable about you hanging around lemmygrad and insulting them over there? Would it be appropriate for a mod here to ban you because you were associated with a community which has been known to make many leftists here uncomfortable?
The bottom line is you’re still able to create civil, unoffensive and constructive conversation here, despite doing things elsewhere that will make people here uncomfortable.
There are two major differences:
A) lemmy is federated with lemmygrad.
B) what self-respecting “leftist” website lets someone advertise and recruit for a bigoted alt-right forum in their comments>??
EDIT: legit, how is plugging wolfballs in the lemmy.ml comments not a violation of the no bigotry rule? What if people start recommending others join the Proud Boys? Or start hanging out on stormfront?
The reason the wolfballs admin should be banned is, as I said originally, that he on lemmy advertised his bigoted cesspit
What if what if what if
That’s an appropriate way to respond to a comment starting with “Imagine if you will”.
I don’t see the relevance of lemmy.ml being federated. That wouldn’t make it ok. If another community we federate with tolerated a couple of neonazis then that doesn’t make those users ok because we find the platform as a whole tolerable to federate with.
I think you have a valid point with the shilling. I agree with you there. It’s not bigotry in itself but it is abusing this forum to promote anti-egalitarian intolerance (which is undeniably and inevitably what that platform primarily hosts, regardless of its admin’s claims of platform neutrality). Plugging wolfballs is contrary to the stated purpose of this platform, and an unlikely but possible gateway to it gaining dangerous popularity. That is something they are doing here on their account, and I would support the rules being updated to ban it.
The difference is that MLs don’t want to kill anarchists. They just think they’re annoying. With fascists, the death drive is built in and it infects everything they touch.
https://nitter.ca/IamRageSparkle/status/1280892535024619522#m
If I understand your story right, we should proactively ban people because their friends might violate rules in the future? It sounds similar to the story of Minority Report, but that was supposed to be a dystopia, not an inspiration to implement irl.
They’re the wolfballs admin, what’s not to get? Don’t be a lib.
So you ran out of arguments and try to insult me instead?
I don’t need to argue anything. Fuck fascists. If you’re an ML like you’ve stated in the past, you know why and don’t need me to explain to you why fascism is unacceptable and how they leverage liberal discourse to gain footing.
If you enable fascists to speak then what do you even stand for?
I don’t claim to be unbiased. I don’t claim to be fair. Because being unbiased and fair is for people who don’t have to worry about their own survival. LGBT people have already learned this lesson when we’ve been hunted down in the past. You gotta nip this shit in the bud before it takes root.
If you make this place a safe haven for these people, then it’s not safe for me or people like me, and I will treat it like radioactive waste.
You are proposing to change lemmy.ml rules so that users can be banned for activity on other sites. Your only argument for this rule change seems to be the claim that wolfballs.com is fascist. You havent shown any evidence to support this claim, and its far from obvious when browsing the site. So I dont see any justification for such a rule change.
You keep ignoring that he is on here every time someone is about to get banned for bigotry offering a safe space on wolfballs. You let the comment section of your Leftist website be a recruiting grounds for racists and homophobes. And you keep saying “can’t police his activity on another site,” but like…how is posting links and promoting a bigoted website not a violation of lemmy.ml’s rules?
I also recommend wolfballs to people who wont fit in here. I think thats better than having them go back to Reddit, or trying to troll us.
Miss me
With that
Bullshit
So now you say that Masterofballs should be banned because of things that other people say on his instance, and because of posting memes?
For fucking racism, yes. Its better than what they deserve to be honest: a gun to the head.
This is exactly why non-MLs look at half the commies and shake their heads. If all you scream is “fascist” and literally refuse to explain, then all we gather is “They call people they don’t like fascists”. Then commies get mad the rest of us “can’t see” the proper way.
How does this not counter your first point? If you don’t practice what you believe in when it actually matters, you don’t have beliefs, you have hobbies.
Edit: This thread has gone on for many comments. Read them for a laugh. Basically they never proved the original guy is racist, only got increasingly frustrated. Which is honestly surprising, since I believe the guy is probably a racist PoS, but all I asked for was proof of it.
I have literally linked to where the guy is being racist and seanchai has quoted his homophobic and transphobic remarks. It’s plain as day. I’m calling this shit out because it makes me feel unsafe to be here as a queer person.
Also, how do you not know what a dogwhistle is?
It’s counterproductive to conflate racism, homophobia and transphobia with fascism.
They’re all disgusting behaviors. Make no mistake, they’re all mindless, anti-social, and dangerous. However lumping them into the term fascism trivializes what makes fascism in particular dangerous or appealing to its audience, it falsely suggests that fascism without those traits, a national fascism rather than a racial fascism (which is indeed what some fascists propose) isn’t reprehensible, and makes people who have seen a defintion of fascism think it’s just an ignorant slur just like calling any queer person a liberal, which will make people just not listen.
You don’t have to be one to be the other. They’re all horrible. Don’t pretend their problem is being a fascist; their problem is being a racist anti-queer idiot.
Congrats on proving both my comments for the second post in a row. Also grats on being queer? Anyways, if you’re so confident you’re right, feel free to actually reply with links of the guy being racist (instead of just saying you did), because the only post I see you doing that has 3 links to… Content not posted by the guy and non-racist content.
Just for transparency, I was the one who banned them. In my personal opinion, I still think the ban was appropriate, but because someone who outranks me reversed it and has told me their rationale, I’m conceding the issue.
Well, that’s something that needs to be resolved, sooner is better than later, or it will lead to more drama later. Are you using your staff position to enforce personal opinions/preferences, or are you taking the role of a moderator enforcing site rules?
The 4 site rules here (especially #2) seem clear to me that people shouldn’t be banned merely for their supposed personal opinions, or what they do elsewhere.
The latter. I thought the rules were such that they should be banned. How I want the instance to be moderated (i.e. rule changes) is another question and something I’ll take up with the other admins.
I think it could be an opportunity to clarify some of the rules. I’ve made a post on /c/meta about clarification of the term ‘leftist’ for example, because the vagueness can easily lead to reasonable, avoidable conflict.
I agree that “leftist” is too vague, but I also havent heard any better idea how this instance could be described.
Well, how do the admins here define ‘leftist’?
That’s actually a major part of my post. We can’t recommend a better idea without knowing your own definition because ‘leftist’ is just so ambiguous. That’s why it’s a problem. If I know how you define it, I can suggest a few alternatives.
deleted by creator
Removed by mod
deleted by creator
People like you are why no one even takes the word rascist seriously anymore.
deleted by creator
You have not demonstrated a single racist post. You just keep repeating it as if it makes it more real.
The admin literally stating he wants to create drama. Who’dve thought a wrecker would want to create drama
A literal Stonetoss comic
Hmmmm, let’s talk about black on white homicide
Depicting someone as having two moms is indoctrination, apparently
Open transphobia
Open homophobia
Racist toward africans
Haha, funny maymay
Nword convo with admin participating
That’s not even everything, that’s just the easy to parse obvious stuff. I need to take a shower.
@nutomic@lemmy.ml @dessalines@lemmy.ml @AgreeableLandscape@lemmy.ml
I was going to re-ban them, but luckily they deleted their account. They went with the hitler bunker method I guess.
as per wolfballs own rules (and confirmed literally in this thread by the admin) the racist posts are marked NSFW, unless a community becomes “mostly racist” and then the community is linked in the sidebar
What do you gain by pretending it isn’t racist there? They’re not hiding it.
You forgot hidden btw. He hides the community from other people, censors it.
Sorry could you explain again how it is that you think hiding racist content is racist again?
deleted by creator
Again how is hiding racist content supporting racism?
What do you think he was trying to do by hiding it? Do you call hiding content promotion?
If I tell racist people they can’t post racist flyers on my house, am I a racist?
Removed by mod
thank god we banned you