The US has two parties: center-right and far right.
surely if you enable a genocide that makes you extreme right right? so it’s extreme right and extreme right
Eh, not sure it’s got anything to do with the political spectrum anymore. At this point I’m not sure what to call it but the US and allies’ obsession for maintaining ties with Israel no matter what feels divorced from… Well, a lot of things, really. But among them the left/right spectrum.
I can’t talk much. Canada is also selling Israel the supplies they use to do their mass murdering.
Support for Israel is right-wing, not because Israel is genocidal, but because support for Israel is how the US secures the Petro-Dollar and brutally extracts the Global South with predatory IMF loans. It’s Imperialism in action.
Liberal extreme right and authoritarian extrem right.
(This is a lie internet lefties tell each other)
What’s the lie?
While it isn’t what they mean, I would say both parties are different flavors of far-right. Both are genocidal imperial warmongers that promulgate oppression of the marginalized in support of neoliberal capitalism. One does it openly while the other plays a game of taking credit for social changes it opposed and occasionally throwing a bone or two to those constituencies even while materially screwing them over in all other ways. And it will throw them under the bus the moment they can get away with it.
Really, they are part of the same team and they fight those opposed to them far harder than they fight each other. Good cop/bad cop for the same precinct.
That Democrats would be considered right-of-center in other countries. They’re clearly a center-left party.
They’re clearly a center-left party.
by what measure?
Seeking social justice through redistributive social and economic policies of government.
the extent and effort at which they create and enforce those policies is the measure of left or right in this country; not the existence of those policies because both republican and democrats say that they want those things; but when you investigate beyond the lip service you find that conservatives will give token-at-best support for the policies while leftists will support it with full vigor.
tldr: the democrats very tepid support for these things is what makes them center-right; because the party that calls itself conservative takes pride in doing this, while most democrats do it too and hope you don’t notice.
longer: democrats only push for re-distributive policies (if at all) once it becomes popular and they’re forced to respond; not because democrats are progressive. see biden’s decades long anti-gay crusade that suddenly stopped once he needed the votes and his expansion upon trumps draconian anti-immigration policies; or clinton’s establishment of anti-gay service and anti-gay marriage; and then see kamala backtrack on liberal positions like pre-k; community college, childcare, medicare expansion, etc. only the democrats very weakly seek social or economic policies of government and; for the most part; behave like republicans when it’s time to put their money where their mouth is; that’s why they’re center-right
it sounds like you’re judging these books by their cover without reading any of the material. we’re on social media so it’s par for the course; but your takes are going to be divorced from reality if you don’t bother to go further than shallow understanding.
Center-left? In what way? They are genocidal imperialists, they aren’t anticapitalist in any form.
They want to use the power of government to reduce the harms of capitalism, via minimum wages, social safety nets, child tax credit, subsidizing more environmentally friendly energy production and electric cars.
No they are not as far left as you and the people you talk to online, I didn’t say that. You are allowed to want different policies. You’re just incorrect to call them right wing.
They want to use the power of government to reduce the harms of capitalism, via minimum wages, social safety nets, child tax credit, subsidizing more environmentally friendly energy production and electric cars.
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No they don’t, lol
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That isn’t “center-left,” that’s center-right.
No they are not as far left as you and the people you talk to online, I didn’t say that. You are allowed to want different policies. You’re just incorrect to call them right wing.
Leftism starts at anti-Capitalism.
Ok I don’t expect you to see it but this is exactly why I said it’s a lie that online lefties tell themselves. Globally, in real life politics, yes you absolutely can be center-left without demanding the overthrow of Capitalism.
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minimum wages, social safety nets, child tax credit, subsidizing more environmentally friendly energy production and electric cars.
Republicans have also votes for bills supporting all of the above.
You have to realize that Republicans are not the party pushing for these things. What you are saying does not retort anything I said.
No, this is literally where the U.S. falls on a global political spectrum. The Democrats would be considered center-right in most other nations. Even by their own historical standards, they’re center right; if you took a Democrat from 1975 and transported them to 1995, they’d ask you why the party had adopted the Republicans’ fiscal policies.
I don’t understand how the Democrats in USA can be considered left-wing. Sure, they are more left than the Republicans, but in my eyes they certainly not left-wing.
I don’t know what country you are from or how your voting system works. But I will guess that your country has many parties and after the election, a governing coalition is formed.
In the US voting system, similar parties get punished by stealing votes from each other. So, in effect, we have to form our coalitions before the election and choose the single candidate that will stand for all of us. So, you can think of the Democratic Party as the Democratic Coalition, made up of some truly left-wing factions, as well as some not very left-wing or even centrist factions, and so our candidate will be much more watered down than what you’d see in a different system.
I am from Sweden. You are correct that my country has many different parties that together form a governing coalition.
Thank you for making it a bit clearer to me! I appreciate it.
There are also Right-wing factions in the “Democratic coalition” you mention like The Cheney’s.
You said it yourself, they are less far-right than Republicans, so Liberals get to pretend they are punks and rebels despite supporting the status quo.
Easy. We set the FBI on all the actual leftists decades ago. So the movement is having to slowly rebuild itself in the US. As a result Progressives are the farthest left things most Americans have experience with.
basically, the US is a one party system, but it has two parties
“The United States is also a one-party state, but with typical American extravagance, they have two of them.” - Julius Nyerere
In the American sensibilities, the Democrats are left wing.
I know we’ve shat on Americans too many times that Democrats are not leftists and Republicans are far-right, but there is a place and time for doing so and I learned to cut Americans some slack. Americans simply have different Overton window because of different history and culture (I have explained before as to why, but I cannot be bothered to write another wall of text about it). Other countries don’t even follow a left and right political dichotomy. Many places, especially in developing countries, vote on personalities than policies. But few of us crap on people from developing countries for not following policy-based discourse, or not following the European-originated sensibilities of “left or right” politics.
Americans are heavily propagandized and are politically illiterate. Generally speaking, they do not even know there is a world beyond “liberal” (Democrat) and “conservative” (GOP). It is considered nerdy and wonkish to even know very much about the two party bourgeois electoral system. So their sensibilities only mean as much as propaganda has eliminated any possibility of political education, let alone capacity for action in solidarity with humanity (even when empathy is there, correct analysis is not) for the vast majority of them. That requires developing projects dedicated to political organization and education outside and away from the two bourgeois parties.
Americans should only be cut slack to the extent that they are ignorant. They should not be cut slack for their knowing embrace of war, domination, racism, and so on. And when you simply inform them of the existence of such things, they will rapidly educate you in their commitment to the project. Perhaps they will momentarily feel bad, but most of the time they will quickly find a psychological salve for cognitive dissonance, lest they act outside of the tracks laid down for them by reactionary and genocidal capital. Our work on the left is to peel off more and more from those tracks and turn them into fellow track-peelers, this is naturally an opportunity for exponential growth if we can consistentlu break past what keeps them on-track.
[Partisan] americans also like to wave off the roughly 1/3 of eligible voters who don’t vote at all as if they just forgot or were too lazy to vote or something. A lot of people are disillusioned with the whole thing, but the partisans are the loudest and the media mostly cares about them so it makes it sound like it’s 50/50.
According to the latest gallup data about 27% identify with each of the two major parties and about 43% as independent (of major parties).
Yes, this is absolutely true. And comparing those who say, “why should I even engage?” with those who overemphasize electoralism I have a hard time saying the latter are more correct. There is a visceral truth to someone who votes for X to get positive change all of with all their friends, then doesn’t see that change because X sold out, screwed them over, told them a line, etc. That is more valid and politically astute than mental gymnastics for why those who campaign on something don’t fight for it once in office.
We don’t currently have our own special political spectrum.
We can make a new one for you so you can feel better about this whole situation. Let’s call it the “the imperial political spectrum”. I’d be happy with that solution. Then you can say you’re left on the imperial political spectrum and it’s all good.
Because American politics is weird and partisan a f.
Anything even remotely left will get you labelled a Commie or tankie by the right, while anything remotely right will get you labelled a Nazi by the left.
while anything remotely right will get you labelled a Nazi by the left.
Yeah it’s crazy how attacking the White House just cuz you can’t deal with the results like an adult gets a group a bad rep. What an unfair world what with actions having consequences and all that.
To be fair, a Left wing revolution is necessary. The Jan 6ers weren’t Nazis for trying to do a coup, but because fascism is Capitalism in decay, and an alliance between the Petite Bourgeoisie and Bourgeoisie. Most Jan 6ers were small business owners and the like.
Oh it’s been like that long before January 6th, and long before Trump even stepped foot in the Republican primaries eight years ago.
That wasn’t me defending Jan 6th either. Trump’s little Beer Hall Putsch was frankly inexcusable, and the fact that he’s likely not going to face any kind of criminal repercussions for it makes the US look weaker than the Weimar Republic.
The Left begins with anti-capitalism. If you aren’t against capitalism, you aren’t left.
Libs are seething at this absolute correct take. If you’re pro free market, you’re a liberal and thats as ‘left’ as you’ll ever be.
Libs are seething, period.
I suppose you could be a free-market type of market socialist? Heavily doubt its common though
That’s actually a really good layman’s explanation. I’m going to use that combined with, “you’re not a capitalist just because you support them. Capitalists are the people who own the capital.”
Won’t even draw a hard line at genocide
It sucks. Liberals will be blaming Arab Americans going to Jill Stein if Harris loses, rather than Harris and Biden, just you wait.
I mean, she is prettier than Marx. Which one did you want to date?
I’m sorry but like, look at his beard. I’d date Marx
That is a pretty good reason.
Who are the bottom two people on the left side?
Thomas Sankara, a Marxist-Leninist who liberated Burkina Faso, and Rosa Luxemburg, of Reform or Revolution fame.
Thomas Sankara and Rosa Luxemburg
I’d like to see memes that are embracing the left but with a clear cut against authoritarianism. This one is too ambiguous.
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'Aha, I have depicted my opponent as the soyjak emoji and myself as the chad!"
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Nobody did.
Saying liberals aren’t left wing is gatekeeping the term. Imagine saying that I’m not left leaning enough. Wtf is that supposed mean!
Liberalism is the political ideology of mainstream capitalism, particularly for the imperialist countries. As the global economic system for decades and decades, this makes liberals a conservative ideology, its members attempt to maintain the fundamental capitalist status quo. Its members that attempt to make substantial changes begin to push at the fringes of liberalism and end up working against it. Reactionaries try to “restore” a largely fictitious past glory and reinforce conservative social mores in order to scapegoat the problems of liberalism onto marginalized communities. Those on the anticapitalist left, those that actually oppose the system itself, are the actually progressive historical actors nowadays. You could have given liberals that label in the 1700s to mid 1800s perhaps, but they are not the defenders of the current order.
Would you prefer blue conservatives?
I used to think you were one of the good guys
Leftism is to go against the current class order, Liberalism supports it. Leftism isn’t an arbitrary vibe, if you’re pro-Capitalism then you aren’t against Capitalism!
Leftism isn’t to go against capitalism though. Leftism broadly refers to the ideology that supports socioeconomic equality. If I’m to remind you of the origin of the terms “left” and “right” as it relates to politics, the terms right and left refer to political affiliations originating early in the French Revolutionary era. “The Left” implied support for republicanism - becoming a republic, and not American republicanism, secularism and civil liberties.
Political scientists and other analysts usually regard the left as including anarchists, communists, socialists, democratic socialists, social democrats, left-libertarians, progressives, and social liberals. Movements for racial equality, as well as trade unionism, have also been associated with the left. Source
The sort of leftism you Marxist-Leninists advocate for is radical leftism. Social liberalism is still leftist.
Leftism broadly refers to the ideology that supports socioeconomic equality
Then by your own definition Liberalism is right wing! This is ridiculous.
you are not left enough.
its not about gatekeeping anything its about describing reality, if u are a worker either u are a pathetic boot licker or u are leftist and ur mouth looks rather muddy.
(just straight up misogyny)
Scratched liberal alert
Smart cutie pies?
Radicalization vs. sensibility
I wouldn’t call Kamala a radical, but I guess I could see why you think that.
I mean she is very radical, in support of Israel.
“Sensibility” is maintaining a dying genocidal Empire?
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Multiplied life expectancy by 1.5, brought literacy rates to 99%+, freed the slaves and peasants from the fascist Batista regime, there’s a lot to love about Cuba.
Get your nasty political memes out of here
