Of course we did bro, AI (or at least, the current use of the term) is here and no multinational conglomerate gives a fuck about the environment any more
It’s not even about AI. It’s just the next growth bubble to milk, there will be the next after.
It never stops.
Oh how I wish it really was.
World is too busy deciding whether to kill minorities or tax the rich an extra few percent to make any progress on this.
We desperately need a socialist revolution.
No we don’t.
What we really need is people to stop fantasizing about spherical revolutions in frictionless societies and do the boring, unfun, hard things that actually make a difference.
It requires people not doing nothing until magically the perfect thing comes along and realizing they’ll have to wade through and actively support shit, until they’ve successfully reformed or composted said shit into something that is finally able to grow the first leafs of anything resembling a society they want.
I’m just so tired of people rejecting the facts of the political systems they live under in order to pretend to chase some other system they won’t see within their life time.
We have to pick the least bad option and then try to make them better because that’s just the way shit works. Acknowledging that doesn’t mean you are complicit or any other such nonsense in the same way acknowledging climate change doesn’t mean you don’t want a climate that isn’t rapidly deteriorating.
“But if x, y, and z people just…” yeah well they won’t, and we know they won’t, so we have the constraints we have.
Not super directed at you, I’ve just been seeing entirely too many naive, in my opinion, fake socialists that seem to only value socialism as far as they can use it as a weapon to brandish against liberals and other socialists who simply see reality and acknowledge that doing anything requires getting your hands dirty.
We have to pick the least bad option and then try to make them better because that’s just the way shit works
No we don’t, and no it isn’t. That’s how the suppression of radical change works. I am not saying that anything short of utopia is not worth pursuing, just that I don’t see why we shouldn’t start from that and then work down to a realistic compromise, rather than starting from the bad options that are given to us. There are other choices, if you can look further than your nose.
No we don’t, and no it isn’t. That’s how the suppression of radical change works.
You aren’t doing jack shit of this radical change you spout on about. You don’t actually want to help, so you come up with excuses to do nothing while feeling better than those who do because your ideas all start with someone else moving first.
I am not saying that anything short of utopia is not worth pursuing, just that I don’t see why we shouldn’t start from that and then work down to a realistic compromise
Because you don’t have the leverage or organization to start there. Instead you must start by slowly working to put out the fire and getting your fellow countryman to see the benefits of socialist policy.
rather than starting from the bad options that are given to us.
You exist in this system, not outside of it. You start here for that is reality, not fantasy. Id love to start from the position of being the rich using my wealth to sway policy. It’s not reality though.
There are other choices, if you can look further than your nose.
List one that doesn’t start with some fantastical revolution you aren’t organizing and aren’t willing to risk your life in as a first mover
If the answer is about forming a new party in a country that has winner takes all or first past the post, I fear you’ve not thought it through.
You aren’t doing jack shit of this radical change you spout on about. You don’t actually want to help, so you come up with excuses to do nothing while feeling better than those who do because your ideas all start with someone else moving first.
Uh, source? Do I know you?
Because you don’t have the leverage or organization to start there. Instead you must start by slowly working to put out the fire and getting your fellow countryman to see the benefits of socialist policy.
The leverage is numbers. 8 billion humans against what, a stadium of people? And the organization at this point is just basic survival instinct?? We’re on a burning planet and being told that yes we need change, but we also need to wageslave while doing it. I do agree on the “teaching” part btw.
You exist in this system, not outside of it. You start here for that is reality, not fantasy. Id love to start from the position of being the rich using my wealth to sway policy. It’s not reality though.
The system is something that monkeys invented. I “exist in it” in the sense in the sense that I am contemporary to it, yes. I exist in what you could call the universe, nature, or reality.
List one that doesn’t start with some fantastical revolution you aren’t organizing and aren’t willing to risk your life in as a first mover
Nice try glowie. I just know what has already happened in the past and can try to extrapolate. And again, I don’t know what basis you have to speak of my character.
If the answer is about forming a new party in a country that has winner takes all or first past the post, I fear you’ve not thought it through.
Jesus christ, is that the most radical, outside-of-the system take you could think of for global policy change?
The leverage is numbers. 8 billion humans against what, a stadium of people?
The idea that 8 billion people would be on your side is the forefront of showing why what you’re suggesting is closer to fantasy than reality. More people than you care to admit are straight up fascist
It is not a “my side” thing. I do believe that 8 billion humans have tackling climate change in their best interest, whether they know it or not.
Uh, source? Do I know you?
You don’t. That’s why its up to you to make your point when making statements like this.
I’ve seen no such actions so without any particular claims, this is just fantasy posting.
The leverage is numbers.
I literally address the fact that you don’t have said leverage and wont get it any time soon in the very thing that you quote.
No one is being convinced by your angsty, snarky, online leftist purity raging.
And the organization at this point is just basic survival instinct?
If you think basic survival instincts are in any way conducive to long term goals… I don’t even have a clever retort. That’s just an insane thing to think.
We’re on a burning planet and being told that yes we need change, but we also need to wageslave while doing it.
You aren’t told, thats the reality.
People stop doing their jobs, without tremendous planning ahead, and they die.
That’s reality.
You are nowhere near having the capacity for a general strike, and you’re losing capacity as the tech feudal lords clamp down on the means of communication, and as people on decentralized platforms are notoriously completely impossible to deal with and hyper idealistic.
Nice try glowie.
See, it’s childish bullshit like this which means we can’t make progress.
My point is clearly that nothing remotely like these fantastical ideas of an underground revolution are actually happening. We’ve seen these grumblings online for fucking decades.
You’d think you’d have literally anything, like non personally, to show for it. Instead its nothing but talk.
Some random not hyper online dude shooting a healthcare ceo in the back because his back hurt and he was hard done by them is the closest you’ve come to that, and it wasn’t you.
I just know what has already happened in the past and can try to extrapolate.
You are remembering selectively, and remembering out of context, because the US is not WW2 germany. They’re WW2 germany with nukes and a military multiples of times more formidable than the next multiple combined.
There is no coalition of countries currently equipped to take them on.
More than that, those countries are all having similar problems with right wing groups flaring up.
More than that still, in recent history, when there have been revolts, they haven’t switched to socialism, or even just more socialism than before in notable ways. They’ve mostly just switched to more capitalism, supported by the US.
And again, I don’t know what basis you have to speak of my character.
Because once again, the online fringe you represent simply has no track record to speak of. They simply have not done anything for decades, and if they had any teeth, there would be something, anything to show for it.
Jesus christ, is that the most radical, outside-of-the system take you could think of for global policy change?
No, it isn’t the previous thing you absolutely do not have the guts or organization for is. This is the accomplishable thing that would not accomplish the final goals and instead would be handing right wing fascists the long term victory on a silver platter.
We’re talking about a socialist revolution here. The electoral process of the capitalist rulers of the United States is hardly relevant.
Its completely relevant to anyone who isn’t a child.
You can’t magically have this whimsical revolution you dream of.
Its 100% a “you first” type of deal where you absolutely are not willing to be first, and don’t realize you have a whole lot of the population you’d need to convince first, and until you do, you need to face the hard realities of the system you live in, and mitigate the damage.
Taxes and levies to incentivise behavior don’t work. People will eat shit salads before they give up their F150s. We can’t just let people pay to avoid responsibility.
Bullshit. Costs absolutely influence shopping behavior. If you drive it out of an affordable range while providing viable, more environmentally friendly, alternatives. People will be forced to change
Have you ever considered taxes to pay for collective goods and services, making peoples lives easier, them smarter, building trust in the idea that government can work and giving the government more teeth?
People will eat shit salads before they give up their F150s. We can’t just let people pay to avoid responsibility.
The F150 people were sold on the ridiculous trucks by the automotive industry. Theyre also much smaller as a part of the problem.
The people who make decisions we all feel forced to live with are the ones whose businesses choose the path of least resistance
F150s are a significant part of the entire emissions of the united states. Cars in general are one of the largest single categories.
How do you change that though? By beating down the people who have the least damage per person? Or by beating down the companies that push these products, and more importantly the ownership class that owns them and casually use private jets to chauffeur their poodles around?
You cannot do one or the other to stop climate change. You have to do both. Again, cars are one of the single largest polluters in the world, and especially in the usa. The working class will need to make changes in their life styles as well. The problem is not solveable just by having companies change, consumers also need to be willing to accept changes in purchasing habits
Our kids will be really ashamed of us.
Short term profits are way more important than the future of our kids I guess.
America voted for a child rapist, no one postering actually cares about kids
I’m already ashamed of us. I have a hard time walking the fine line between preparing my children for a difficult future and raising kids who know happiness.
I just chose to never have kids because there was never any possibility that humanity would overcome our narcissistic greed prior to ecological collapse.
That was 20 years ago. The last decade has only solidified the certainty of collapse in my mind.
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Humanity is conducting a reckless unplanned terraform of the only place that can sustain us within lightyears, at the very least, and have killed off 70% of the macroscopic biomass in less than a human lifetime, but not to fear… Some nonce cunt on the Internet called you a doomer!
I’m sure billions of mentally-ill talking chimps doing whatever they believe benefits them personally will all magically sort itself out before we destroy enough of the natural processes we depend on.
Ok denier.
it seemed like my kids probably wouldn’t have a good future, so i didn’t have any
Based
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”
Guys. Chill. The world will be fine. The planet will go on.
Humanity, on the other hand, is fucked.
That depends on how you define world. I would include all life on the planet to be part of the world. We are actively killing biodiversity, wiping species from the earth, all from our direct negative contributions to the world.
So yea, the planet and life overall will find a way, but not all life that happened to live in the same era (and after) as humans
Sorry, all life? Even the mosquitoes? Damn.
Fiiiiine, not mosquitoes…
Obviously.
Humanity, on the other hand, is fucked.
We deserve it
I’ve really been feeling vindicated for my choice not to have children lately
More food and resources for the conservatives to multiply. Great choice in resigning the once great humanity to corrupt sociopaths 🙄
Such a silly argument. Contributing genetics isn’t the only way to influence future generations. I may not be a parent, but I (and many more people) educate others’ children every day.
Just because someone doesn’t bring a kid into the world doesn’t mean they’re giving up on the future. Individualist cultures may have people thinking that nuclear families are the end-all, be-all of child-rearing, but it still “takes a village.”
Let them raise their children in the hellscape they created. Let them explain to their children why things are so awful. I won’t be around nor will my children have to suffer for the choices all those conservatives demanded.
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No single person can fix the system. But it can be fixed over generations
The problem is capitalism
The old Soviet Union’s environmental record wasn’t great. And environmentalism was very low on the Dengist priority list.
Capitalism incentivizes industrial growth. But it was the “free” real estate of the colonial era and the massive surpluses of the industrial era that incentivized capitalism and created the illusion of unlimited economic expansion.
The problem is one of economic planning. Can we, as an intelligent advanced civilization, collectively manage the scarce resources of our planet? Or will a handful of individuals continue to divide and conquer the proletariat mass? Simply going socialist isn’t enough. Bookchin will tell you that. Hell, Kropotkin will tell you that.
It isn’t enough to merely establish a central and democratically managed local economy. We need a world wide organization capable of balancing the current demands against future resource constraints on the scale of centuries. And we need it to be equitably operated by a planetary consortium of committed socialist ideologues, not a handful of post-war juntas that run one another into the ground in another Cold War.
Consumer-capitalism. Neither is great, but their combination is truly horrifying.
-Sent from my iPhone
We all know we are fucked. I am living in the moment till it all ends and never having children. Humanity will destroy this planet long before it changes course.
Covid convinced me we’re done.
We couldn’t even get people to wear a fucking mask to protect themselves from a disease they saw killing their neighbors. Shit - we can’t get them to allow other people to wear a mask.
The part that absolutely kills me about this is that there were anti-maskers during the 1918 “spanish flu” pandemic. This suggest that with two valid examples that this is a bad idea, people still chose to not do it. It also suggests that we’re still the same society that we were 100 years ago.
https://www.history.com/articles/1918-spanish-flu-mask-wearing-resistance
We’re still the same society we were 500 years ago, just with technology.
Planet will be fine. Humanity and many other lifeforms? Not so much.
Mass extinction event is all ready happening so yeah
Only when we can step away from capitalism can we change course. Until then, the system locks everyone in and we’re just tinkering with detail. And that step will be a rough one, but it is necessary.
Modern society is locked into reliance on capitalism systems. Nearly impossible to go off grid completely without insane risk of health and survivability for 99.99% of modern urban people.
urban people
Funny how I don’t remember the last hospital I saw in the middle of a corn field.
Hospital is less important if you starve. We’re dependent on Capitalistic farmers and grocery markets. The farmers are dependent on the seed industries for most mass produced crops with higher yields.
Farmers are also dependant on soil quality, temperature, sunshine, equipment that largely relies on fuel, and distribution for the crops they grow.
Not being an oracle myself, I’ll take an educated guess that when the temperature keeps climbing, the conditions that allow for outdoor food production will also change. Likely, the hardiness zones will shift to places with no farmland, and the current hardiness zones will be subject to flooding or drought or both.
Might be tricky business if the best farmland is suddenly on the side of K2.
there are people who literally believe in magic and avoid guilt in all capacities in favor for an afterlife free of repercussions
stop the proliferation of ideologies that support fairytale images of uniqueness and pursuit of boundless wealth, they lead to the most ugly behavior towards all other animals including other humans
Haven’t we missed it like 10 years ago?
The target of staying under 1,5 degrees Celsius above the pre-industrial average temperature within the century was set less than 10 years ago. It was considered ambitious but possible back then, and so many world leaders and governments agreeing to it in the Paris climate accord of 2015, was considered a major political achievement.
However, there have been uncountable political setbacks since. Aside from Donald Trump’s two election wins and subsequent horror shows, we’ve gone through a pandemic that brought insane financial, monetary politics and crushing inflation, the Ukraine war and the advent of power hungry AI (that totally will be good for something and ain’t no god dammed bubble, seriously stop calling it a bubble, bro, it’s the future). All of which has reduced climate change to a niche topic that don’t hold any sway over political elections in the rich countries responsible for the brunt of greenhouse gas emissions (directly or indirectly).
Less than 10 years ago we thought it would be possible to stay below that target over the coming 85 years. Less than 10 years later that target is declared dead by the secretary general of the UN… Was it realistic then? Well, a lot of planning and climate policy has involved exceeding 1,5 degrees and then using massive deployments of imaginary future technologies to bring the climate back. Not exactly prudent reasoning.
Some countries are still sticking to their plans, kinda. Norway are making headways installing carbon capture technology on their off-shore oil rigs (!!!) so that they can keep drilling for fossil fuels with a smaller impact on their own reported national emissions.
Not taking away from your larger point but mostly not inflation but profit taking. Early in COVID corporations holding functional monopolies learned demand was inelastic and commenced to price gouge.
Yes, but we’re still missing now too.
Ah, good point. Let’s see if we unmiss it in 2035.
At this point it’s a matter of how bad.
Yes, but let’s not forget that 1,5 degrees C was considered really bad to begin with.
The next topic under this Post is that Texas sues Tylenol because of autism claims.
We’re fucking doomed. Thats what I personally think and I really Wish and Hope that I’m wrong.
We are fucked.
Thats been humanities lower back tattoo for a while now.
Have more kids! Have pets! Don’t worry, we’ll just all move to Mars!
It’s over. Even if every single person and corporation did an about-face on this right now, inertia alone would carry us into the consequences this was intended to avoid. Enjoy it while it lasts.
If everyone got together and came to the decision to fix the planet, it would probably still be possible, even though it’ll likely get to a point where going outside is a complication. Generations, to be sure.
Though of course, we’re never all going to agree on how to go about it, so you might be right.
