Alternative title: “Follow these 17 convoluted steps to stay in your abusive relationship longer.”
And feel like an idiot when Windows 10 support inevitably gets extended in a year anyway.
Well there are 3 options and they are all bad.
- pay to upgrade your PC (or for extended 10 support)
- stay on 10 and go without security updates
- jump through hoops to update to 11 unsupported
It’s almost like being on Windows is all bad.
- Use another OS (I hear temple OS is even better then 11 these days)
I would vote for 2. myself, its not like the security updates have been deal breakers before (nothing is secure anyway).
You’re about to get ripped to shreds for daring to suggest the odds of anything actually happening to someone on a recently discontinued operating system are not dramatically higher as long as the user has basic use cases and basic tech literacy.
Eh I am used to it. Even when I ask for an example of a end user getting compromised from using out of date software (like a news story, court case, etc.) and they come up empty I am still somehow the “insane” one. You are better to learn to back up things, not get caught in phishing attacks (the most common risk) and watch your accounts then even worrying about security updates.
Worked 15 years in the industry but, hey what do I know… Not like your bank is still using server 2008 and windows 7 or anything…
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It does make me wonder if perhaps malicious actors have novel intrusion methods waiting in store for the deadline because they know those people won’t just get a patch the night the intrusion gets detected. MS would probably love it, because some people would go running scared to pay to upgrade.
Oh we’re talking about all options including outside of Windows? Well gee life has a lot to offer, even things more glorious than using Linux.
4th option…(Microsoft’s favorite one) Buy a whole new computer compatible with windows 11. Vista style.
*bites the tongue as hard as possible to not say The Thing*
Install Hackintosh MacOS
/s
Go ahead… you can whisper it to me
Find God and switch to templeos. /s
Jk. Everyone knows Hannah Montana Linux is the next big thing.
ᴵ ʷᵉᵗ ᵗʰᵉ ᵇᵉᵈ ˡᵃˢᵗ ⁿᶦᵍʰᵗ
I started wetting the bed again when I was 11. It continued every few nights until I was 18.
Then it turns out I wasn’t urinating at all. I was just raised in a very controlling home, which meant I had no idea what masturbation was.
It wasn’t until I started having sex that I found out I had been having wet dreams for years, and getting made fun of for it by my dad.
Now my dad is in his 70s, and wonders why nobody will talk to him anymore. Newsflash asshole! You can’t talk to mommy anymore! 103 is a great age to live to, but people aren’t immortal.
Look man, I don’t know what to tell ya. If you didn’t want to read about my penis, then you should have stabbed your eyes out with a fork as a child.
My penis is like Visa. It’s everywhere you want to be!
I wish Roblox would stop having their fight with Linux and I just convert my kids over.
They absolutely don’t need Windows for anything but Roblox at the moment.
Otoh, Roblox is evil and you could just use the switch to Linux to be like, “oh no, I guess we can’t have Roblox anymore!”
My home is more of a democracy than a dictatorship. I could of course forbid them from playing, impose whatever sanctions, But they have fun doing it and they have a bunch of real life friends that join them.
My home is more of a democracy than a dictatorship.
Oh, now you’ve done it, you’ve pissed off the tankies.
Dude, if I could get them to seize the means of production…
Damn, as a father, I feel that.
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What is a tanky? Only heard that after switching to Lemmy. What’s the origin?
Edit: God damn, definition was far more literal than I imagined!
tankie = stalinist/maoist style communist, take control of everything, anyone who resists, run them over with tanks.
lemmy.ml has a bunch, also hexbear and especially lemmygrad.
They seem like angsty tweens who suddenly realized they figured out the solution to everything, and anyone who doesn’t listen to them must be dealt with.
Specifically referring to scenarios where tanks were used in conflicts between civilians and the state, such as Tiananmen square or Chechnya and expressing support for the side using tanks.
Tankie is a sort of derogatory term for people who whitewash and cover up the horrors of communism.
There was a rebellion in the Soviet Union. The SU responded by rolling tanks into town and violently busting it. This put two sides of communism at odds; On one hand, there was the plight of the working class (the rebellion) and then on the other there were the actions of the people in control (the tanks). Tankies are the “communism has only ever helped people, you’re just listening to capitalist propaganda” folks who decided to side with the tanks, instead of siding with the working class. It’s sort of like calling someone a fake communist, [insert “No True Scotsman fallacy” argument from a tankie below], because a “real” communist would side with the working class.
You see it a lot on Lemmy because many instances have some major communist lean. After all, the “anyone can run their own instance and be in charge. No centralized instances, if you don’t like the mods you can just change instances” concept of the Fediverse jives very well with communist ideals. For instance, the “ml” in lemmy.ml is meant to stand for “Maoist/Leninist”. And that means the entire communist spectrum is on display; From both the more moderate “yeah communism has some cool parts but was also responsible for some major humanitarian crises” to the more extreme “those crises [were caused by individuals, not by the political system]/[never actually happened at all. They’re lies made up by capitalists to deter people from supporting communism!] Communism never actually hurt anyone.”
Any democracy can be replaced with a dictatorship with well placed CIA intervention.
It’s not like they have a lot of election choices, I’ve kind of got a one-party system going on. They can vote for me or they can vote for my wife but they’re getting the same thing either way.
The problem is, they’re eventually going to determine what kind of nursing home I go to. If Roblox buys me chicken pot pie Thursday I’ll considerit a win
My man is thinking ahead.
I respect your approach. I bet you’re the kind of parent who apologises to their kids when you make mistakes
My dad refused to tell me what’s he apologizing for when apologizing, so his apologies were kinda insincere and a way to show that he can do shit behind my back and then just “apologize” and pretend it’s something good.
He was messing in things not his to deal with in the first place. Thinking he’s the smart one there. Naturally it generally wasn’t so, and then he never answered any questions I’d ask.
Now he’s also dead, so I can’t even ask him again.
OK. Back to the subject - parents should be honest and consistent, and also always understand that their kids are different people, and no part of them belongs to the parents. And that no, parents don’t know better. When the moment comes that a parent’s advice is consciously rejected, they should just take it. When they are not let into something, that means it’s not their concern, period.
You have to own that shit it’s the only way you can expect them to ever own it.
Within reason, I have to hold myself accountable to the same level I expect them to.
It’s all a big balancing act. Getting enough discipline in to make them responsible without using so much the lie to you and hide stuff.
I wasn’t raised that way, I want to do better by them.
roblox works on linux https://sober.vinegarhq.org/
Run a Windows VM in
<insertYourDistroHere>and run Roblox?They’re not on the finest of boxes and a lot of the Roblox games actually need some decent resources.
When we get closer to the drop dead date I may give it a shot. I’m kind of hoping Roblox will get around too not being pig-headed about it.
You can definitely give a VM enough power through KVM and qemu to run Roblox. You can even try your hand at single gpu passthrough if it’s worth that much time having youe kids switch to Linux. Not putting a value statement there, I think it is but that’s besides the point.
You can also give quite a bit of power to virtualbox with 3d and hardware acceleration.
I have an unraid with a 2070 super passed, but all the hardware here is 7th/8th gen. They’re barely scraping by on doors/obbys with baremetal :)
Maybe next year they’ll get some upgrades with Debian attached :)
Could try finding them a new game to play on the new system. I’ve never played Roblox myself so don’t have any suggestions, but I’m sure there’s something that will scratch that itch for your kids.
ITT: People who talk about Linux (as if that was the subject) because they just can’t accept that some people actually need or want to use Windows and might find articles like this one useful.
If you need Windows, don’t run it on hardware that doesn’t support Windows 11. If you need it, do it the right way, so you can count on it working.
Now, what do you do with your old hardware? There are plenty of good ideas in the comments here.
Or instead of installing Linux as a workaround and having to learn how to use a new OS and having to troubleshoot a ton of inevitable issues to make it work as well as the setup you’re used to just… Use a workaround to skip the hardware requirement! In the end both are a way to work around Microsoft’s requirements, one is something you need to deal with once just requiring you to follow a guide and you’re done, the other will be an ongoing learning process.
Honestly the only people worried about learning a new OS are people that have not even tried another OS for longer then 15 minuts in the last few years.
The desktop is still a desktop so is the taskbar.
The mouse works like a mouse, browser works like a browser and the majority of apps these days are browser apps.
The single actual difference i can think off is that rather then downloading an exe you use something similar to an appstore if your non technical or the command line if you don’t.
And if you are just a little technical you can acutely download that exe and install/run it just fine. (Wine)
Worrying about learning an new OS isn’t as simple as you make it. It takes time, dedication, and will power to work through the pain points.
Most Linux users give answers like “just use Linux” but it’s not that simple. Yes, it’s easier to switch these days because more and more apps are browser/cloud based. But technically a chrome book would be an easier switch if that’s the mentality.
I “use” my PC. I don’t simply check email and go on Facebook. I’m currently trying Linux for probably the 4th or 5th time. It’s easier to get into these days, but it still functions completely differently than Windows, as it should.
For example, It took me at least an hour to figure out how to partition and mount a drive. There’s some not so clear information out there so finding the right info wasn’t as easy as it should be. OK no big deal, now I know, but I don’t necessarily want to chase answers like that every time I use my computer.
Lastly, I’ve never accepted using Wine as a work around for unsupported programs. OK, maybe if you have 1, but not if you have 6. That’s not an acceptable solution when your needs scale up like that. And I have many. I’m not going to 100% get away from Windows. It sucks, but it’s reality.
You do sound like a person knowledge enough to solve their own issues and you have been trying linux so I wouldn’t lump you in with the majority of users that believe that all of linux requires terminal knowledge.
I let you in on a secret. I still have my windows drive in dual boot. I was very scared of linux, i just saw a hyprland gif and fell in love. As a windows poweruser i could not fully commit on that whim.
I have not booted into it in months and i use the same drive to install proton games. (So i can theoretically launch them from both sides) but i do plan to keep it there, just in case. At least for as long as i use that machine.
So by all means you are pretty much as much a limux user as i am, the only difference is with what os we dedicate time.
Recently i got into a powershell course from work and i know you can use 7 on unix, but i am actually thinking of spinning up some windows vm. My work is all windows so i do need to keep up. And there are good things i could say about it.
But i have a personal drive to learn linux, rooted in the philosophy of technological freedom, unrestricted by corporate whims. One day i hope to truly leave windows for a foss new world (does not need to be linux) and i hope sincere that on your own time, you will also join me there.
I’m with you on the philosophy of tech freedom, which is why I’m back to trying Linux again. So yeah, we’ll take that journey together.
I just think its over simplified by most, and I guess I got the wrong impression of you by your 15 minute comment.
I’ve seen multiple people recently post something like, I’ve switched to Linux and can never go back…but I hated it for a year. That makes so much sense to me, and I just feel that most Linux users leave off the learning curve part, and just gloss over to fully knowledgeable use.
So many people just don’t have the time or energy to just jump into something new. I’ve been using windows for 30 years, and learned a lot along the way. Its going to be tough to learn Linux without daily usage and experimentation (and totally screwing stuff up). That’s a tough pill for most people to swallow.
It took me at least an hour to figure out how to partition and mount a drive
This is honestly surprising to me, because the process is basically the same on most Linux DEs as it is on Windows:
- search for “partition” and open the app
- select the drive you want to format
- adjust partition table
- apply
The UI is a little different, but the two major DE families (GNOME and KDE) have a partition tool built-in with a nice graphical representation of what’s going on, which is IMO more intuitive than what I’ve done w/ Windows in the past (hasn’t been since Win 7, so things may have changed).
That said, if you search for it, you’ll get a half dozen (or more!) answers because everyone has their favorite tool (fdisk, cfdisk, etc). But what’s provided in the default installs of most major Linux distros is dead simple. And that’s why I recommend Linux Mint to new Linux users, it comes with pretty much everything you’d need out of the box.
I’ve never accepted using Wine as a work around for unsupported programs
Agreed. If you need specific Windows software and it isn’t available on Flatpak, I’d tell you to stick w/ Windows.
But if you’re okay with learning using something similar (i.e. you can use any word processor and don’t specifically need Word), then by all means, muck about with WINE if you want to give it a shot, because you have a high quality alternative as a backup plan.
That said, if you only need one or two Windows-specific apps occasionally, I’d recommend setting up a VM or dual-boot. I had a VM for years because I needed a couple Windows-specific apps occasionally, and I was okay with the performance hit on the rare chance that I’d need to run it.
It sounds entirely like FUD. In my opinion Plasma wayland is prettier, far more simple, and much more mature than Windows. Windows feels old, clunky & now uses dark design as part of its UX.
How long
withwill working around the requirements work? If I need Windows, I’m not going to risk it.Then get newer hardware, simple as that, anything from 2017 or more recent will work.
Yes, that’s what you should do to run Windows.
And then use the noncompliant hardware for Linux.
That’s not true, the OG Ryzen technically meets the requirements (has the TPM chip), but at least when I ran the upgrade check, it failed. So maybe update that to 2018.
How is having to apply workarounds to keep windows working on old machines any different from troubleshooting the occasional linux issue? It’s a rethorical question, the difference is that the workaround on Windows is mandatory while the Linux troubleshoot is nowadays rare and usually related to edge cases.
Some of the workarounds in this article are far more involved and convoluted than what I’ve ever had to do in 15 years of linux. Some are even dangerous for system stability and security. My very recent install of bazzite in a new laptop has been a perfectly out of the box it just works experience. Not even having to open the terminal. 100% friendly GUI without compromising flexibility, power and customizability. Today, suggesting linux with a solid desktop environment like KDE plasma is just foolproof. The end user will be using exactly the same knowledge and habits of Windows, without the harassment machine that is MS now. The change is not learning a new OS, is just switching a few assumptions on how some advanced things work.
Meanwhile I started on Bazzite, my display signal just stopped whenever there was load on the GPU, two days trying different things to make it work, switched to Mint, GPU works but wifi antenna doesn’t, another couple hours to make it work… Windows? Install it and… Well, that’s it, it just works.
Let’s not pretend there isn’t driver hell on Microsoft, sometimes its even worse than Linux.
Yup, on Linux, you have three possible outcomes:
- works perfectly - most common
- doesn’t work at all
- partially works
Ideally, you end up with 1 or 2, because 3 gives you hope that you’ll get it working properly eventually. I had this happen on my desktop, when I got a new motherboard, the WiFi chip gave really crappy performance because it was stuck on an old Wi-Fi standard or something. I got it to work at ~20mbit/s, but eventually gave up and bought a new Wi-Fi card for $20 or something and now I’m getting way better speed. And this was despite following my own advice to only buy Intel hardware, this chip is just notorious for having issues and is certainly an outlier (replacement chip is also Intel, but a more capable chip).
I had a lot of frustration on Windows w/ my wife’s computer running AMD’s audio driver and AMD GPUs, whereas both just work on Linux. After a couple hours, it mostly works as expected, but it’s still a bit janky. So it absolutely goes both ways.
I’ve had weird Linux issues similar to that before. However, I’ve also had weird Windows issues too where it didn’t “just work”. I’ve had 2 experiences that really stick out to me with Windows
The first was Intel ARC, I absolutely love the card I have and was using it on a dual boot system. Linux ran it like a dream under Mesa, I just had to install a few more packages to get GPU compute for things like Blender. But Windows was an entirely different story. The driver worked great but Windows update was the absolute worst thing to ever come out of this. I’d have my driver all up-to-date and Windows update would come along, and completely downgrade my driver, to this one specific driver (I don’t remember the exact version) that didn’t even support Intel ARC Control. It would do this randomly too, sometimes during a game, or during Blender renders which caused those things to crash and waste hours of time. It also had a 50% chance to just completely blue screen my system, which lead to a broken/incomplete driver install. It was a mess
The other was with a friend’s laptop I was helping repair. It was running Windows 11 and kept blue screening left and right for what seemed like RAM and driver issues. Tried switching out the RAM sticks, ran Memtest86, all tested good. Tried a new SSD and a fresh install of Windows 11, same issue even before any drivers were even installed. Tried the same thing but with Windows 10 and it worked flawlessly. The laptop had full support with Windows 11 and no workarounds was necessary but Windows 11 just didn’t work at all.
Not to say that Linux has been a smooth ride the entire time, far from it. But Windows has been pretty much the same from my experience in terms of weird bugs and crashes.
TL;DR: I’ve had my fair share with Windows shenanigans, been way too many times where it didn’t “just work” as much I would’ve liked. From GPU drivers to the entire OS.
On Mint, you troubleshoot the wifi antenna following a guide once and then you’re done. On Bazzite you probably just needed to click to change to X11 instead of plain Plasma, on the login screen. I would bet money that you have an Nvidia GPU. Sometimes Nvidia breaks the drivers support on Wayland. They intentionally neglect it in order to keep your kind of mentality around.
On Windows, MS is going to eventually fix the workarounds so you can’t update your computer anymore.
All AMD setup
Funny how people are downvoting when all I’ve done is specified that no, it can’t be justified by the hardware I’m using.
“to avoid learning new things, just learn these new things instead and repeat as needed until it doesn’t work anymore! duh!”
It’s so annoying to see in literally every thread about windows
Its part of their personality.
They remind me of my devout jehovah witness neighbor who’s been doorknocking and dropping flyers in my mailbox for 20+ years to remind me I’m going to burn if I don’t convert.
Sure, and the article exists for those who want to go that route.
Comments are comments, as in discussion about and around the topic. In this case, people are discussing Linux as an alternative, because it is a viable alternative for most people, especially the type for whom this article is too complex. Discussion about Linux as a viable alternative is therefore absolutely welcome and should be encouraged.
I also welcome discussion about macOS as well, especially since they have a really good track record for supporting their hardware with software updates.
If this pisses you off, just know that Microsoft will probably make more changes like this that will piss you off. They’re trying to take more control over your computer little by little, and right now they’re doing it in the name of “security,” but eventually they’ll likely drop that and just make changes for the sake of lock-in. So if this pisses you off, you should consider alternatives if they’ll work for you.
The thing is, it’s impossible to have a discussion about Windows on Lemmy because they automatically get hijacked by people who only have one thing to say “Install Linux you idiot.”, they add nothing to the conversation and are off topic.
Agreed, and it’s really unfortunate. In many areas, Lemmy is much more of a “hive mind” than Reddit was, probably because a lot of people with similar ideas got pissed about the same thing and left around the same time.
ITT: Stockholm Syndrome victims defending the abusive relationship they have with their OS.
Newsflash, honey: she doesn’t respect you; she only wants to exploit you. It’s time to break up!
TFW you continue fucking around with Windows rather than learn Linux
Sure as soon as I can take my software with me.
Can’t you do that with Wine for the most part?
No idea, Altsnap, xmbc, everything, windocker, openshell, everything toolbar, fancyZon(ms powertoys) and ditto clipboard manager.
Most of these are very unlikely to work with wine as they address general weak spots in both windows and linux
I ended up taking my unsupported computer and turned it into an Unraid server. Bought some refurb enterprise drives on eBay to get it set up, and now I have an awesome home media server/NAS.
Why should I be curious about unraid (I have a case and a bunch of drives btw)?
It’s a low friction way to set up a home server with NAS and docker containers. The “Unraid” portion is the configuration that lets you set up an “array” with parity drive(s), but without striping so each disk has a complete filesystem and files accessible even when removed from the array. Everything can be managed through a web UI, and there’s a robust “app store” of docker containers.
The downside is that it’s not free, and they recently moved towards monthly/yearly licensing and increased the cost of new lifetime licenses.
Thanks! Not for me then but close :-)
Hmm, I wonder if the server install trick would fix my issue with upgrading to 24H2. On my desktop system, when it reboots for upgrades, it bluescreens saying it can’t find the storage device. I’m guessing it’s something to do with the RAID driver.
Edit: nope lol
just use linux
I only ever use Windows on my work computer, and only when I need access to a resource that requires our Windows-only VPN.
But seriously, “just use linux” is worthless advice. Lots of people use Windows for specific applications that don’t exist in the Linux ecosystem. For example, there are no Linux applications that come close to AutoCAD, and it simply doesn’t work on Linux.
Better advice would be to get new (or newer used) hardware if possible, if you absolutely need to use Windows, since this workaround will inevitably be “corrected” by Microsoft. Then you can do whatever you like with the old hardware, such as install and learn Linux at your own pace.
“just use linux” is great advice. Not everybody has the money for PC upgrades. And the amount of people that require specific Windows programs and can not switch to an alternative that works on Linux is extremely small.
you are talking about a small minority of users. what percentage of users use autocad at all?
Not many, but plenty use various corporate applications that are Windows-only.
such as?
As an engineer, all my jobs so far have used niche internal corporate software which would only be available for Windows. This would be Document Management Systems (DMS’s), internal reporting tools (progress and hour keeping), software distribution programs etc.
And of course the engineering tools themselves are often only built for Windows, whether it’s proprietary PLC programming environments or CAD software.
That said, I can run both WSL and a corporate-approved Debian VM on the same work laptop as a compromise, for whatever makes sense for the task. Still sucks though! At home I’m a Debian fanboy 4 lyfe.
you are still talking about niche software though
in my office about 90% of people there could be using linux for their daily tasks with no issues.
Interesting, how would that work if your corporate IT department uses an (Azure/Entra) active directory system? Can you use a bare metal Linux OS on a Microsoft-based domain service? Asking out of ignorance and curiosity.
Just wondering, what kind of VPN is windows only? FortiNet? GlobalProtect?
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It’s some kind of locked-down version of GlobalProtect that’s integrated with a TPM module to prevent machines that aren’t running our corporate image on corporate-approved laptops from being able to connect.
There’s probably some kind of workaround, but I’m lazy and it’s easier just to power up the Windows machine now and then.
Aw hell no!
Give me a good Linux distro that’s great on a tablet PC
ubuntu. anything with gnome, really.
You can’t even open an application on Gnome without pressing the small Activities button on the top left of the screen.
touch input uses gestures instead, not unlike android.
Well, I can simply open an app by tapping it on the home screen on Android. What do I need to do on Gnome?
i dont have a touch device with gnome, but you open the app drawer with i believe a left swipe. on android you usually swipe up instead.
So no quick way to open my 30ish favorite apps? Is there also a gesture to close an app or do I need to press the close button?
Using windos is like being in an abusive relationship where your partner goes through your phone all day every day, you pay all the bills, you don’t get to have sex or laugh, and you’re reminded every day that you’re paying too little and that there is so much more you should buy for your partner.
Just install Linux already. Yes, Linux has its problems too, but they are less and easier to fix than this turd
Has nobody heard of a vm? Who the fuck runs windows on bare metal thats fucked.
14 billions computers probably
Ud think people would learn after they all blue screened.
If you’re talking about crowdstrike… They didn’t all blue screen. That was caused by third party software that caused the same sort of issue (kernel crash/panic) on Linux boxes not even 3 months earlier.
Just spitballing here, but I think the vast majority of the United States corporate workforce?
I struggle to have any sympathy for them.
Great Scott, you are toxic
You can use VMs even more ambitiously. If your wi-fi is not supported by FreeBSD - there’s a
wifiboxport, basically it runs a minimal Linux with PCI passthrough.And of course if I need Windows, it won’t be bare metal.
