Tim… suing everyone else wont make epic store a great place to buy games
Look to GOG for inspiration…
He’s just salty because the only games people “purchase” are the weekly free ones.
I don’t even bother with those anymore. I never play the free ones I have, because I’d have to use Epic’s software.
Keep collecting them. Each one you get costs Epic money and helps counter some of that Fortnite cash that lets Epic keep paying for exclusive contracts. Keep bleeding them and eventually they won’t be able to keep buying exclusive releases.
Epic pays a flat rate to offer games for free, they don’t pay per download.
Downloading them just helps Epic inflate their “active users” number when talking to investors.
Not even. I’ve bought games on Steam that I forgot I had in Epic because Epic is just that trash. Fuck Epic for trying to start their store by bribing developers for exclusivity on their platform. Bitch ass tactics to begin with and then crying and whining when their mob mentality strong arming didn’t work. Best believe if their shit had worked and they became popular those greedy assholes would be asking a higher percentage once everyone was locked in.
I love hating epic just as much as anybody else, but those exclusivity deals are not necessary just bribing the devs.
The first Hades game would have been much smaller in scope and features, without epic funding them and helping them implementing something like EOS, the game would be definedly worse than it is.
Remedy has also stated they could not make Alan Wake 2 without Epics funding. People often say the Epic exclusivity ruined its salea, but realistically without it there would not be a game.
But even so, i think them suing Steam is a asshole move.
Ok, and what about games like Rocket League? It was already wildly popular. And didn’t we get interviews from a few exclusivity deal people saying that in the long run it wasn’t better than just launching on steam?
But yes, I’m glad 2 games got made despite Epics shittiness. Maybe if they built features into their launcher they’d have more. How long did it take them to make a friends list? And last I heard, wasn’t viewing your own library still largely dependent on you knowing what games you already owned?
Yeah, never gonna defend that shitstain of a company. They tried to bully their way in and failed and they deserve it 100000%
I even stopped with those.
Yea. Like one or two good ones and sandwiched with a bunch of trash games no one wants.
Thanks for the reminder.
It’s Definitely Not Fried Chicken.
true
“They charge developers too much!”
“Ok, Tim, so how exactly do you make money for your company, then? Because giving away all the free stuff seems like awfully bad business.”
Never thought I’d be defending a company charging a lot of money but since Steam actually does provide an excellent, stable service with bonuses like Linux development and the Steam Deck I mean, I really ain’t that mad, especially they still offer really good sales.
“They charge developers too much!”
So you should be able to undercut them, right? Right?
Apparently the epic games store isn’t feeling so good, Mr. Stark .
Exactly. Epic doesn’t even appear to really provide a particularly good service so you’d think a more bare-bones company could get away with charging less, and yet.
Not when the Steam Terms of Service prevents them from charging less on other stores.
People are still repeating this lie, huh?
I mean is obvious if they killed valve or even knocked it down a peg they would raise prices on devs so fast.
“They charge developers too much!”
“Ok, Tim, so how exactly do you make money for your company, then? Because giving away all the free stuff seems like awfully bad business.
I think you’re missing the point that Epic’s store is only not profitable at their margins because of scale. If they had even half of Steam’s user base they would be profitable. Their problem is that gamers insist on backing Valve’s monopoly because it’s what other gamers tell them to do online.
And Epic provides Unreal Engine, the gaming engine that powers the majority of modern games, with free and extremely cheap tiers for indie devs, and they provide explicit Linux support for their engine and dev environment. They’ve also used a substantial amount of their Fortnite money to break up app store monopolies on Android and iOS.
They are not the villain that the gaming community thinks they are.
Have you considered maybe Valves monopoly is natural? That is convenient to have all the games in one place and their customers like what they’re selling?
Have you considered maybe Valves monopoly is natural?
Yes that changes literally nothing.
All monopolies, be they natural or otherwise, need to be heavily regulated or else they can:
a) easily do stuff to prevent competition. Stuff like preventing developers from selling their game for cheaper on other stores.
b) charge exorbitant markups, markups like 30% of all revenue for a listing in a store.
I do not understand why gamers have such a hard time grasping that Valve taking a massive cut off the top of every single game sold, just enriches the already rich for doing nothing, at the expense of consumers and creators.
Sorry to bust your balls, but here’s a thing from a fucking 6 years ago that debunks your B point to the ground.
30% has used to be standard in a PHYSICAL releases too, except these wont give you any convenience like cloud saves, remote play, family share, friend/community integration, support for older releases, huge ass discounts, linux support, and may other pro-consumer things. Valve takes this chunk and actually invests in the quality of their service.
Do you really think that MS or Epic would keep low markups if they have gained majority of the market?
Lmfao bro, you think that digital storefronts cost more to run then physical ones?
You think it takes more resource to change a database entry, then it does to run a physical store, staffed by real people, that have to import and store a physical item that they then have to sell you, and potentially take back and return?
Lmfao, Valve has tossed you trinkets over the course of 20 years and you praise them like they’re altrusitic gods, instead of the wealth hoarding millionaires and billionaires that they actually are.
Do you really think that MS or Epic would keep low markups if they have gained majority of the market?
Jesus Christ, thats literally the whole fucking point. Valve has been overcharging you because they have a monopoly.
Competition is what keeps prices low, and that’s not possible when Valve has clauses that prevent developers from selling their games for less on other stores.
Steam provides much more than just a store. Having to print, burn, deliver and sell physical CDs is not cheap. Nor is the service Steam provides that physical discs wont. Also, did you pass over the fact that PS, Xbox, Nintendo, Apple and Google also have charged 30% for their online stores?
Anyone can go get free games at Epic and be happy they save 100% cash on their games. and that is why Epic’s user base grew 173% withing last 6 years but with 1.6% revenue growth. If this doesn’t make you realize that we pay for a good service, then nothing will.
PlayStation and Xbox subsidize the cost of the console.
Apple and Google have been having their 30% fees (and the monopolies that allow them) struck down by courts and competition regulators around the world.
That’s has absolutely no chance in hell to happen while these right wing fucks are in charge. Any “regulation” would be a secret dick in the ass while they make everything worse and somehow we all end up paying more.
So you’re a Republican then? You believe in small ineffective government and have no faith that government can do anything, ensuring that it won’t?
Congratulations, they converted you to their side without you even realizing.
They may want to work on their marketting, then. I won’t lie when I say that I’m surprised to learn that Epic Games not only developes Unreal engine but that Tim Sweeney seems to have actually created it and not just be a CEO who buys stuff and puts his name on it.
There do, however, seem to be a few points really not working in their favour. Sketchy policies around reviews and a lot of forcing exclusivity(Steam’s monopoly? Ok buddy) are big ones I found.
Look, I’m sure there’s plenty of learning to be done as far as the Epic Games store is concerned but seriously, why is Steam so bad and why is Epic Games especially good? Sorry that I’m happy to use Steam and not switch to a new store with fewer features? Like, what’s the point being made here?
There do, however, seem to be a few points really not working in their favour. Sketchy policies around reviews and a lot of forcing exclusivity(Steam’s monopoly? Ok buddy) are big ones I found.
Forcing exclusivity? They force exclusivity for the games that they make (just like Valve does for theirs) and otherwise Epic offers developers cash deals for exclusivity, the developers are under no obligation to take them.
And the overall point is not that the Epic Launcher is amazing, but that Tim Sweeney is right about Valve’s exorbitant 30% fees, but whenever that comes up gamers just go haha Valve=Good, Epic=Bad.
Yeah, but you do not seem to grasp that good service and agreeable progresses e.g with proton and the nice hardware is worth the money.
I don’t really get your point. Epic already offers free games and more money to devs, but isn’t working out. Steam isn’t forcing exclusivity on third parties here. And they’re not using tricks like the crazy good (for the devs that’ll find it hard to say no to easy money) exclusivity deals or paying for the free games in desperate attempt to get anyone even look their way.
If my reliable old grocery store that says hi to me every morning and always delivers when I ask them for anything, add nice features to make the shopping just feel smooth and welcoming, then also, on the side, made huge contributions to open source in a consistent basis, being one of the sole corporate interest driving the current Linux gaming paradigm forward…
If they suddenly had a shop pop up next door with cheaper prices and free food stuffs every week, I would be very fucking suspicious. Nobody greets you there either. No nice features. It’s cold and lacks accessibility features. Goes out to buy all the bread from the old reliable shop and then sells them with big signs on the sidewalk saying “this is the only place to get bread!”, I would 100% not go there. Ever. Just from principle alone. They can give out all the free shit they want, do whatever sleazy tricks they want, but I’ll go shop in the place that is friendly, listens to me and others, helps the community and does not go buying other shops out of bread as a cheap ass trick to force customers there. It may cost more, they may pay a little less to the producers, but it’s very rarely just about money. If the volume alone covers the producers’ wants and needs so they are happy to remain, and customers are more than happy not getting free shit or occasionally having to wait a year or so before they can get bread again because the fucking rats next door keep buying some out of existence anywhere else.
Sometimes it’s just a service question. Money isn’t everything. This is true almost everywhere. I almost exclusively shop in co-op groceries where we the customers are owners. It’s more expensive, but I have a say in everything, it’s inclusive, does not do sleazy marketing or exclusivity tricks or other ratty stuff, so I’m more than happy to pay the premium for it.
And I’m not the only one. Not by a mile.
Same’s true for steam, at least for now.
The second they sell out or stop contributing good around them or start ratty shit, I’ll be looking to shop elsewhere. But that’s still not going to be the rats next door…
If they had even half of Steam’s user base they would be profitable. Their problem is that gamers insist on backing Valve’s monopoly because it’s what other gamers tell them to do online.
Well, see, here’s your first mistake; you think Valve has a monopoly. But they’re just one store out of many, including game console stores. The difference is they’re actually providing a good service.
Yes, it’s shocking; people tend to gravitate towards the service that’s actually good!
And Epic provides Unreal Engine, the gaming engine that powers the majority of modern games…
And what a total shite of an engine that is. It’s actively destroying the gaming industry by emphasising all the worst development practices gamers have complained about for the past 8 years.
… with free and extremely cheap tiers for indie devs…
Just like with their service fee, they’re doing this to completely undercut competitors, to ensure the Game engine everyone used is Unreal.
This isn’t a good thing.
… they provide explicit Linux support…
No they don’t. They barely support Linux with some elements. But Unreal Engine runs like absolute shit on Linux, if at all, and Tim Sweeny infamously hates Linux with a passion. He has some personal grudge against it.
They’ve also used a substantial amount of their Fortnite money to break up app store monopolies…
Because they want Fortnite to be the one game young people play. The One Live Service To Rule Them All. The only way they can do that, to reach the maximum amount of the youngest generations to squeeze them and their parents for all their money, is to be as widely available as possible.
Valve got skin gambling. Epic got Fortnite. The latter involves children and is massively more profitable.
Lmfao, you’re so brain dead that you think Unreal Engine is a bad thing.
Jesus fucking Christ learn how to think critically and not just suck Gabe’s billionaire dick.
Unreal Engine is a bad thing. Or maybe you haven’t noticed how every game that’s made with Unreal Engine, all the way back since UE4, requires far more resources than is necessary to run what it’s running.
If you support UE5 and Epic you support actively destroying gaming as an industry, and game creation as a multi-faceted art.
Or maybe you haven’t noticed how every game that’s made with Unreal Engine, all the way back since UE4, requires far more resources than is necessary to run what it’s running.
We’ll all wait for you to cite your source on that one, because, no Unreal does not perform particularly worse then any other game engine.
Unreal is broadly available and not just hidden behind AAA walls so a lot of A and AA devs won’t have time to optimize their games with it, but they wouldn’t have had time to optimize regardless of whether they published with Unity or Godot or any other engine. Unreal is certainly a vastly more efficient engine then Unity, which is its main competition.
Also, how are you squaring away the idea that Unreal is ruining games as art? There are two options:
-
be a creative game designer and spend all your resources on engineers to build you a custom game engine, then spend more resources training everyone at your company on how your specific niche engine works
-
be a creative game designer and use an off the shelf engine like Unreal to run and render your game so you can spend your resources on artists, writers, and designers, and everyone comes in knowing how to use it
Do you really think that number 1 leads to more artistic games? The literal entire reason we’re in an indie game mecca right now is because of the widespread proliferation of third party game engines, that let small dev teams focus on the game and not the engine.
We’ll all wait for you to cite your source on that one, because, no Unreal does not perform particularly worse then any other game engine.
You’ve been living under a rock.
Nothing else you say matters after this, because good gods, you don’t know anything.
Cite your source dumbass.
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Isn’t Tim the guy that advocates for pedophelia through AI generation?
And Hitler was a vegetarian, but that tells us literally nothing about whether we should abuse animals in factory farms
Sure, but I think wanting to fuck children does kind of paint a vivid picture about your general moral character in a way your dietary preferences might not.
Hitler actually did both. Several of his “girlfriends” were 14 when they met.
He also managed to become the guardian of his 14 year old niece at one point.
I feel like this isn’t a reciprocal thing though. “Guy does good thing” /=/ “You shouldn’t question his judgement/his other ideas are also good. ” feels fair
However
“Guy does bad thing” = “You should question his judgement/his other ideas tend to also be bad” also feels fair
Stop, stop, I already have so many reasons to hate him, I don’t need more.
Reminder: Epic CEO Tim Sweeney has defended child pornography, saying that stopping it is “gatekeeping”.
Please link to a source when you say things like that.
Thanks!
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Out of all the digital stores Steam arguably offers by far the most actual functionality and features for its cut. It’s still too high, but it’s possibly the least egregious example vs Apple, Google etc
It’s only too high if they demand exclusivity.
And they don’t.
They are providing PLENTY of value to anyone who is listing their games there.
Would I like to see them do more now for small and independent outfits? I would! but 30% isn’t that much comparatively to the old days of buying physically distributed things in a brick and mortar store.
I remember buying final fantasy 2 (4) on snes and it cost 95$ US this was 1988 or 1989
Which was about 129 CAD (the exchange rate is between usd then and now is about the same conveniently for this tidbit)
Today after years of inflation it would cost about 250-260 USD or 340-355 CAD
I don’t fucking miss those days at all. And while there are multiple factors here in play, this is entirely fair to charge silksong 6 dollars ish per sale on a 20 dollar sale whilst the failing AAA games 30 dollars on a 90 dollar sale. There is a cost involved and it is because of steam, specifically steam, that made digital distribution what it is today. And by that I mean they have set the standard for what is a healthy location to sell your digital goods.
And to give an example of what garbage (yes you Tim Sweeney you giant whiny fecal faced fuck) digital distribution for games would look like if steam didnt actually do a great job, look at books.
Buying books on through amazon you pay more for them then you used to for a physical copy of the book itself.
Has Tim Sweeney shown up in the Epstein files yet or are we still waiting?
Tim Epic might not have gotten rich enough early enough to be noticed by Epstein
Says the guy that won’t support Linux. Fuck the completely off.
The only reason I had an epic account was for their free giveaway. And now that I’ve switched to bazzite, and considering their poor Linux support, I’m inclined to just cut bait on them.
They thank you for your support
TBH, I would take their stuff even if I get it for free.
No instead epic charges 12%, and if you use unreal engine but don’t sell on egs they get a 5% royalty fee on all your sales. Sure those number are lower but egs isn’t out here “empowering” devs
Epic would charge Steam’s fees if they had Steam’s marketshare.
Everyone thinking they care about creators or customers is a fucking moron.
Are they close to feature parity with Steam yet? Like after a quick search of it looks like they added cloud saves but that took years.
if you use unreal engine but don’t sell on egs they get a 5% royalty fee on all your sales.
Sounds like abusing market power.
100%. Valve needs to start suing Epic for their game engine monopoly. It’s not about Valve it’s about protecting gamers.
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Yep, time to wipe my Epic account.
Shoddy article buries the lede: Epic isn’t suing Valve. UK residents are. Epic is just rooting for them because Epic makes a product (Epic Game Store) that competes with a product by Valve (Steam). Epic is not behind the lawsuit. They are just cheering for their competitor to be taken down a peg.
Literally nothing whatsoever stops Epic from releasing their Epic Game Store app on Windows, macOS, Linux, and Android as these are open platforms that allow anybody to release an app (or app store) and offer it to their customers. However, Epic Game Store only actually exists on Windows, and it’s on iOS in the EU. Everywhere else, they’re keeping it from consumers out of pure spite in order to leverage the courts in their favour.
All of this started because Epic chose to defy Apple and the rules they agreed to in order to get Fortnite onto the iPhone’s App Store, in that they could not use an alternative payment provider to sell “V-bucks,” the in-game currency Fortnite uses. V-bucks cost Epic nothing to make as a virtual currency. Fortnite itself has expenses, but Fortnite is also a tech demo for the Unreal Engine. It exists, on a business level, to sell the capabilities of Epic’s in-house physics engine, the Unreal Engine. A bit hypocritically, Epic takes a cut of games sold that use the Unreal Engine. It is not free. Fortnite players use the V-bucks to buy skins and other cosmetic experiences in the game. And Epic, tired of giving Apple a 30% cut of something that costs them nothing to produce, thereby giving each company 100% profit, added an option to pay Epic directly, either less money to get the same amount of V-bucks, or the same amount of money to get more V-bucks (I don’t recall and it’s not what matters). Apple suspended the Fortnite game until Epic fixed it. Epic refused to, so the app was de-listed, and the developer account was banned.
Epic then pulled out of the Mac ecosystem as well, which had absolutely nothing to do with any of this. Macs do have an App Store that looks like the one on iPhone, but just like the Windows Store in Windows, it’s not required to install apps on a Mac. Most Mac users get their apps from the web, same as Windows users do. Like the Windows Store, the Mac App Store is just a convenience (both of them handle updates very well, for example). Not offering Fortnite and/or the Epic Game Store on the Mac has always been a choice Epic made, not any limitation imposed by Apple.
Epic is not just Fortnite, though. They made the Gears of War games for Xbox back in the day. Fortnite itself is actually a mashup of several games. The original Fortnite was a paid survival crafting game. I’m not sure it exists anymore, or if the freemium multiplayer Fortnite swallowed it up entirely. Like in Fortnite’s main mode, you could build, but you could build freely (safely) during the day, and mobs would attack at night. Fortnite also contains elements of Unreal Tournament, Epic’s prior multiplayer online shooter that last received a release in 2004; Rockband, the music game developed by Harmonix (which also created Guitar Hero), which is now called Fortnite Festival), and other acquisitions. Epic also made Unreal, a single-player game that Unreal Tournament was based on. They likely released a few other games I can’t recall. But since Unreal and Unreal Tournament, they’ve also licensed the Unreal Engine to other developers, and it’s been used in numerous games, including the original Deus Ex.
However, Epic Game Store only actually exists on Windows, and it’s on iOS in the EU.
Your information seems to be outdated. On the EGS download page I get an “Install on Windows” link with text below it “Also available on Mac OS, Android, iPhone (EU only) and iPad (EU only).”
That is indeed a recent development. I might have known it if I didn’t say people who prey on children should face stricter jail sentences and get banned from a site that supports people who prey on children, and thus lost access to the MacGaming subreddit, where I’m sure they posted about EGS coming back to Mac.
Logging in, it’s interesting to see that so many games I own are supported on Mac. I started playing Dredge on Xbox Game Pass but never bought it. That might be fun on the computer. And it might run on mine. (Nobody buys a Mac for gaming. I’m a gamer who prefers a Mac computer to one that runs Windows… so I have an Xbox. Long story as to why I don’t have a PlayStation.)
However, Fortnite is not (yet?) available for Mac. Maybe if they brought EGS to Mac, they’ll bring Fortnite back. I’m not a big Fortnite player… another long story that is beside the point.
Yeah, I think that was not the case during their recent lawsuit with Apple. So relatively recently that changed and was limited for a “good” reason.
No Linux support though so whatever. Useless to me.
although I like a lot of what Valve does (I have a lot of Steam games, valve games, have a steam deck oled, use steamvr, etc) they are a fairly flawed company. sweeney is so great at shooting himself in the foot though that any opinion he has people will by default believe the opposite of (and probably should)
Switch to Gog :)
The only interesting argument I heard about this demand was that when you buy game you are tie to respective store, and you cannot buy content like dlc outside that store. I wpukd be amazing for the customers if thus wasn’t the case
What everyone else is saying, but god do I hate the fortnite art style.
