“You know we have cameras in that town. You can’t get a breath of fresh air in or out of that place without us knowing,” Milliman said to Elser, according to Ring doorbell footage of the Sept. 27 encounter viewed by The Colorado Sun.
And he saw nothing wrong with that.
I strongly encourage everyone interested in this topic (and you should be!) to read the article because this shit runs deep and they see absolutely no problem approaching the law in this fashion. Absolutely disgusting erosion of liberty and privacy, though it’s not the least bit surprising. Here’s an excerpt i found particularly chilling–this cop is fully convinced (or acting as if he were) about the validity of this minimal-effort investigation they apparently were ready to arrest someone over. Note that weeks later it was fully disproven and ended with a terse email acknowledging that she provided enough proof to absolve herself as the suspect. No accountability for their mistake, just: “you can go now”
“You know we have cameras in that town. You can’t get a breath of fresh air in or out of that place without us knowing,” Milliman said to Elser, according to Ring doorbell footage of the Sept. 27 encounter viewed by The Colorado Sun.
“Just as an example, you’ve driven there about 20 times in the last month,” he added.
Along with the Flock footage, the sergeant told Elser he also had a video from the theft victim that allegedly showed Elser ringing the doorbell before grabbing a package and running away.
My favorite part
“I guess this is a shock to you, but I am telling you, this is a lock. One hundred percent. No doubt,” Milliman said.
😳
But Elser, a financial advisor, told the sergeant she had no idea what he was talking about. She asked several times to watch the video that Milliman insisted proved her guilt, but he refused to show her. And when Elser offered up footage from her Rivian’s onboard cameras to prove her innocence, Milliman said she could bring it to court.
“It doesn’t matter. I’ll be giving this all to you. If you are going to deny it to me, I am not going to help you with any courtesy,” Milliman said.
“It’s kind of funny because we have cameras on our truck, so we could show you exactly where we were,” Elser said.
We are really fucked here. No accountability on their end, while foisting 200% accountability on ours.
This reminds me of how police abuse any new tool they’re given.
Like how while trained dogs can actually sniff out drugs, when they’re given to police, they get retrained to simply alert whenever the police want them to, and essentially become a flimsy reason to let police violate your rights and search anybody they want to.
And the police suffer zero repercussions for their actions. If they don’t find drugs, there’s nobody who’s going to take them to court and force them to retrain their dogs or to disallow drug dogs from being used as reasonable suspicion.
We are really fucked here. No accountability on their end, while foisting 200% accountability on ours.
Is there some reason victims can’t just sue flock into oblivion?
Good question! Frankly, i don’t know. I have a feeling there would be some way they’re protected in this arrangement since they’re ‘helping’ law enforcement but that’s far from even approaching legal precedent. I imagine questions like yours are going to be challenged in the courts as we move forward… 🫠
Qualified immunity, Hasan Minhaj did a whole Patriot Act episode on it
If “video of someone roughly looking like you” is enough to completely reverse the burden of proof, then you can throw the whole justice system out of the window.
I thought it was interesting that she was ok with all the neighbourhood surveillance until it was used against her.
Worth noting that Ring has announced a partnership with Flock.
So if you’re in the Ring ecosystem, maybe time to re-consider.
lol it’s literally an Amazon business. Should have been time to reconsider when Bezos loudly said that Ring footage can be used for anything they want.
Problem isn’t your own use, it’s everyone using them, as a network of real time surveillance cameras at the beck and call of corpo terrorists
Definitely. You’re giving the surveilance state placement though.
She feared the impact a theft charge, though small, would have on her financial career.
Wild that a false accusation, after being proven as false at the court of law, can still impact one’s career.
because when they run a background check on you they see you were charged. and that’s all that matters. you are untouchable to most employers.
Yeah, that’s something that absolutely has to change. I don’t care if “career criminals get out of charges all the time”. A false charge should not follow you for the rest of your life.
Then again, I also believe that if you serve your time in prison and are released, you should not have a publicly searchable record that can be used to deny you opportunities. So take my opinion as you will
Agreed, and prison should be for rehabilitation.
Perhaps prisoners could be released in one of two states: completed time or rehabilitated. The latter carries a much lower chance of recidivism. Maybe the first iffense could be hidden regardless, and expunged entirely after some period of time (10 years?), whereas on the second offense, both are searchable.
IDK, but I do believe in forgiveness.
My friend in Australia had a judge lie that he pleaded guilty to a previous crime (in reality the chips dropped the charge). That kind of bias can invalidate her decision should he appeal (there were plenty of other errors in the decision too).
However it is near impossible to find a lawyer who will appeal and point out the judge lied because that lawyer would fear coming up against the corrupt judge in future.
I don’t think that’s true, do you have evidence of that?
In my country, employers have low trust and expectations on their new hires (and therefore low wages and high turnover) so they ask anyone applying for work to show up with what’s called a “police clearance” and a “NBI clearance” (NBI = National Bureau of Investigation, a less-sophisticated developing country equivalent of the FBI) documents to make sure they’re not felons.
deleted by creator
No different to cancel culture
What are you on about
Everyone freaking out has forgotten: Do not talk to the police. Guilt is determined in court and anything you say, drumroll please, can be used against you. You will not talk your way out of getting arrested, shut the fuck up, and sort it out in court. The only person there to help you is your lawyer, the police are not there to help you.
Damn I use to love these guys videos. Taught me a lot over the years. Shut the fuck up when cops ask questions!
So because she is better off financially and is not worried about google tracking, she had all the cameras, GPS tracking, and everything set up to prove her innocence.
I decline all of that stuff and i would have a MUCH tougher time proving my innocence when wrongly accused like she was.
This is just another step towards fascism where police are charging people for crimes they never committed, based on AI and computers screwing up.
WTF? Do I have to allow shit in my car and phone to start tracking me to provide evidence in my favor when some ai decides it has “tracked” me? The only reason this lady got out of it without getting a lawyer and going to court is she allowed all the bullshit in her phone and car that I block. And if she didn’t have it, what would have happened in court?
that’s exactly what I got out of this whole situation.
guilty until proven innocent.
That’s how they’re running it, and there are a whole lot of people who would prefer it to run that way in the future.
What should be happening is: when falsely accused and exonerated in court, you get a judgement against the LEA for treble damages for your costs to rebut their false claims.
False claims are going to happen, but if they’re costing the police thousands of dollars per instance, that should slow them down. I’m more than happy to pay increased taxes to put that deterrent on the agencies.
The root of the issue is allowing officer to lie in order to deprive people of thier rights.
He knew he had nothing, he was just trying to get a confession by saying it was a 100% lock. The cameras wouldn’t matter as much if lieing like that was illegal.
The fact that police officers can lie but people can’t shows you the terrible power imbalance in our law enforcement.
Also there’s no legal obligation to answer your door.
Should disabling these cameras be considered community defense? Discuss.
No.
😎
It should be considered a moral imperative.
🫳
🎤Casually asking just for general knowledge, but what would be the penalty if someone, say, accidentally destroyed one of these? What about 10?
No wonder Stephen Miller is so against citizens wearing masks.
Edward Snowden did try to warn us over a decade ago.
In many instances, they are “rogue installations” aka trash left on the side of the road that no one owns now. Check with your municipality if they have an agreement for them. If they don’t, feel free to put them in the bin where they belong.
For anyone unaware, there is a community effort to map these cameras. https://deflock.me/
Someone who isn’t me is wondering if there is any sort of rapid glass etching compound that would help to decorate the lenses for them.
Seems like some kind of oily fog/spray could obscure things until someone took the time to physically clear it. More temporary, but perhaps easier to accomplish?
Edit: And this pisses me off that I have to think about such things.
A very salty spray would be effective. The spray itself would obscure the lens until it is cleaned and cleaning it would be a pain in the ass to do without damaging the lens.
I imagine a sufficiently strong acid could discolor it pretty quickly.
Yeah but I am guessing you can’t safely dispense it from a super soaker.
Vinegar might do the trick, and that’d safe in a super soaker. Make it salty for extra impact.
no matter the tools, cops remain as stupid and malicious as ever
Time to get a high power laser pointer and start taking out these cameras
Just be veeeery careful about reflective surfaces so you don’t hurt other innocent people. Make sure you wear laser glasses that you bought from a real reputable place, Amazon and the likes are full to the brim with counterfeits that don’t protect you from anything.
Good looking out, laser glasses weren’t on my mind. I’ll be sure to get a pair when I get my laser
I know she was acting to protect herself, but its too bad we couldn’t see this played out in court.
Everything about this is so messed up that the incompetent, lazy cop is the least surprising part.
