Andy Yen, the CEO of Proton, had a message for an employee in the company’s security Slack channel who urged the company to at least take a few days to pentest newly written code before pushing it live. “That’s bullshit and loser thinking. Of course it’s possible to be fast and secure,” Yen wrote in the channel at the end of August. “Stop thinking always of how to be slower, and focus more on how to be faster.”
In a follow-up message, Yen reiterated his point: “only losers think like that.” His ultimate message for the team was to “stop lovingly handcrafting all our code and use AI more.”
I’d like to thank Andy for introducing me to Proton’s competitor Tuta.
He certainly clarified for me whether to pay for Proton or not. It’s not.
I just cancelled my subscription and quoted him as the reason.
same here and i will forever be thankful for it :p
Tuta, funnily enough, makes it very hard to send encrypted mail to people who aren’t also using tuta. Maybe also look at Mailbox.org and Posteo. They have a lot less marketing/hype/fearmongering compared to tuta and Proton, but have similar features regarding encryption and security, with less walled-garden like restrictions.
Do you have experience with the office software or cloud drive from Mailbox.org? Proton’s spreadsheet app can’t even handle my modest flashlight collection and their Drive won’t mount as a drive on my Linux machine.
For something like a personal flashlight collection, you might try LibreOffice Calc. Esp since you mentioned using your Linux machine. I use librecalc for random things kinda like what you described. It works great, and your files stay local.
No, I just let them run the mailserver, both the mail clients and all other Web applications we need are hosted by us.
I just took mailbox.org for a spin and wasn’t impressed, I have to say. No apps, which I can live with, I guess. There was an option for installing the various functions as apps - but apparently Firefox isn’t compatible. So sadly it’s a no from me, I need a bit more functionality from a paid service.
I don’t want/need an app, and would say that there are more than enough mail clients on all platforms.
If you want one, though, I can see why this is a no-go.
I can give +1 for posteo. I have my posteo adress some years allready.
I’m currently in the market for a new VPN provider. I’d like to thank Andy for pointing me towards IVPN.
IVPN has been working well for me. Heard AirVPN is good if you need port forwarding too.
I’ve literally registered with them yesterday. Seems nice so far, worth exploring further.
Every time this asshole speaks it just throws the entire company even further off a cliff lmao
As someone who has been an Executive Director, I couldn’t imagine taking a political stance on anything. Good way to alienate your customers and lose profit. Anyone with a couple of brain cells to rub together knows this.
Idk, somethings are worth taking a political stand on, not all things, but something. The all mighty dollar isn’t all there is to life
Maybe I’m a particularly sensitive, spiteful snowflake, but if the boss of my company accused me of being a “loser” because I cared about the quality of the product, I’d be looking to deliberately sabotage the product. And for a new job, of course.
Many of us are in exactly that position with our employers, but finding another job in this climate is easier said than done.
Stop giving Proton money
WTF? Is he 12 years old?
Is this really true?The business culture is sick. This way of thinking is not limited to just a few people.
Get rid of Andy Proton
Ah shit balls! 3 months into a paid up email, calendar, drive and VPN suite. Have moved a lot of files over. Will start looking again, but definitely separating everything from now
I just got out of my 1 year membership with them and happily moved over to tutamail and selfhosting 😅
My membership end in march… Tome to find another mail hoster.
Everything is going this way, best to set up a list of things to do to help yourself move quickly each time, you’re going to be doing it a lot.
Great strategy and one I’ve adopted (now).
RIP Proton.
Privacy minded people tend to also want security.
Every company seems to be rolling out software with no testing these days. Why? Is this what they think their consumers prefer? Why would we want glitchy accounting software with a chat bot that can’t actually do anything? I think they broke supply and demand with AI somehow
2026 business has got very little to do with customers/consumers, supply and demand. Maybe it’s been that way for a long time, but this ‘AI’ nonsense has bought it to the surface, evidently.
Obsession with numbers? 🤷♂️
I think that Libre Office and /e/OS are still avoiding use of AI. Maybe mailbox.org as well. However, when the user base is growing, they all probably get more pressure to be catching up with the competitors.
Ugh.
I’ve heard Andy interviewed. Couple times. He came across as personable and likable. But that takes a backseat if he’s gonna steer his company off a cliff and I have to stop trusting their products. Even smart people can make dumb choices. Esp when no one is empowered to push back. It can get pathological, when the CEO starts to believe they walk on water.
Frankly I think the Proton Foundation needs to sit Andy down and have a heart to heart.
Considering what he said, I am a bit pissed that the AI stuff is basically the only thing that matters. Like he (and the first image) mentions that he spoke to an employee badly, but it is almost forgotten about with the larger part pleading that people don’t think they use AI for everything. But if he can express so many repetitive things about AI, then he could address the actual human that wasn’t “using AI more”. I know the part that people are mad about is the idea of speed-running security with too much potential AI involved causing some profit drops from current and potential customers. Just kind of weirds me out how even in this plea he is using the topic of AI more than the fucked human behavior.
Thx for the screenshots. I read them both.
Well…some people are linux distro hopping and me…email hopping…f*uck
I commented before from the summary. Read as much of the 404 story as I can now.
It’s bad. If I didn’t trust 404 Media, I might think this was a hit piece. But 404 does good work and I trust their journalists. I should really subscribe!
Social media is prone to instant lynch mobs, one of its worst aspects. I do not intend to rage quit. But I WILL re-evaluate in 3 months. Just marked my calendar. They need to very publicly reverse course, AND restore my trust. I believe in giving ppl and co’s a chance to learn from mistakes, or nobody ever gets wiser. But I need to see that happen, or me and my $ are out.
I also no longer trust Andy’s judgement. The Proton engineers are saying the right things. Again I trust 404’s homework, or I would be much more skeptical of all of this.
Proton is legit, they said.
It seems like they offer a good product, but by my reading they are still on the venture capital.
I’d rather let them enshitify a couple of times before making a commitment with anything private.
guess its time to host my own email
