This might just sound like the same old shit others voice with the recent gaza genocide, but ive hated israel for far longer. In high school i read a book called the olive grove, its based on a true story of a Palestinian family that lost every thing to the zionist movement. It follows 3 generation of the family from the first world war till after the second. It tells of the horrors they faced by the us backed terrorists taking their home and land turning away from the atrocities being committed. Its heart breaking, and when i read it in 2009 i didnt fully understand but seeing all the shit done now, i just think this cycle of hate started and can not be stopped.
Idk what else to say, i mean i could go on and on but i dont have the mental capacity to do so while drinking. I recommend others to read the book, it was a very good read when i was a high schooler and i plan to start it again as soon as i can find my copy.
Here is a link to the book if anyone is interested in reading it https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2327988.The_Olive_Grove
Yeah man idk about worse than nazis. It’s extremely hard to be worse than nazis. You need to go read up on the horrors the Nazis committed before saying anything is worse or as bad as Nazis.
Since we’re talking about hot takes, here’s mine. The Nazis are the most reviled because Hitler did the “unthinkable”: he tried to colonize the colonizers by claiming to be whiter than the whites. So, the atrocities committed by nazis are somehow way more inexcusable than the ones committed by the British over “brown people”. They ran concentration camps too, but since the victims were black, people doesn’t seem too bothered by it.
And don’t get me started about slavery, where people were grabbed and treated like animals, packed in ships as packages, and forced to work in their own concentration camps for the white guys.
What the Nazis did was horrible, but let’s not pretend they’re the only evil ones. Israel is just as bad, the difference being they’re doing it over brown people which makes it somehow more acceptable on the eyes of the world.
Thats a new take i never thought of. Interesting.
Most Israelis are now ‘brown’ people of Arab or North African descent. They’re also the group that is most likely to support (far-) right parties.
I’d like some source on that because the rise of the far right on the EU and USA says otherwise.
No problem.
On most Israelis being of Middle-Eastern or North African descent:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mizrahi_Jews_in_Israel
Bit of a tangent, but this is partly why Israel’s security services are/were so feared in the middle-east. They simply employed ‘Arab’/Mizrahi Jews, who were indistinguishable from other Arabs and often knew the culture.
On Mizrahi Jews being more likely to support (far-) right parties:
https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/israel-why-right-wing-mizrahi-vote-misunderstood
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-05-19/ty-article-magazine/.highlight/in-some-respects-mizrahi-identity-in-israel-is-dominant-and-ashkenazim-face-inequality/00000188-2f95-d914-af8c-afb5a0fb0000
If you want you can look up (recent) Israeli cabinet ministers on wikipedia, you’ll often find they have Middle-Eastern or North African ancestry. Often these are some of the most right-wing politicians. For example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_Golan
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itamar_Ben-Gvir
Wow, TIL. Thank you very much for the sources.
If they were even close, there would have been nothing left of Gaza after the first three days. Everyone that managed to survive somehow would be in concentration camps already. So yeah, not even close. Still bad tho…
Just because israel is going about their genocide differently doesnt make it less evil. They have the support of many countries that felt bad for what hitler did to them. So of course they are keeping a line of not going to far in order to stay looking like a good guy.
So by your logic this is equal in evilness
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Massacres_committed_by_Nazi_Germany https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_human_experimentation
17 million is a larger number than 30,000.
That doesn’t make what the Israelis are doing excusable or any less of a crime. It does mean what they’re doing isn’t on the same scale as the Nazis.
There have been larger genocides. Nazis are only at the forefront because they were the only ones to industrialize genocide. The intent and rhetoric of Israel is directly comparable though.
Since the six days war? Nah
The Nazis killed more people out of more people over a larger period of time. In Gaza at least 30000 people have been killed, and that at least is doing a lot of heavy lifting, in less than five months. There are also at least 60000 wounded, again at least. Now remember that all of Gaza has 2.5 million people. Leave Israel for four years and in relative terms they’ll be about as bad as what the Nazis did.
30,000/2.4 million (population of Gaza) = 1.25%
6 million Jews / 9.5 million pre-war European Jewish population = 63%
Operation Rheinhard:
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.aau7292
1.25/9.5 = 13.6% of the Jewish population in Europe in 100 days.
I get people are angry and why people make the comparison, but it’s quite easy to debunk that it was on a similar scale to what the Nazis did. The numbers don’t lie.
Nazi/Holocaust comparisons undermine any criticism you make of Israel, because what they did is so clearly on a different scale. If you want to win the argument, it’s better to avoid these hyperbolic comparisons.
Okay good point. I guess I underestimated the Nazis.
Where are you getting 17? 6 million Jews, and 5 million “others” is what I found.
Are you counting war casualties?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_victims
Leopold II, Stalin, U.S. Indian Removal Act, Genghis Khan. It’s doable, sadly, but with Israel the issue is scale, not intent or magnitude of the hate involved.
The nazis had about a decade to commit evil, but israel has been at it for 70+ years. We dont even know all the horrible things that have been done. So no ill stick with worse then nazis. This is unpopular opinions after all.
Yea and I respect the community, not downvoting you for doing exactly what this community is for lol
He’s downvoted by people who can’t accept the truth. This happens all the time to me especially if I mention the word Zionist/Zionism.
Nah. Hes being downvoted because the Israeli government isn’t doing anything as evil as the holocaust. And he keeps insulting the people that disagree. Its not on the same level, even slightly, but it’s still fucking evil. By all means, hate Israel for this. I have since I was a kid and the IDF killed my babysitter in cold blood. They’re not nazis, but theyre evil genocidal monsters who should be reviled nontheless.
Besides gaz chambers, i would say they are similar. Both used famine as a strategy and instead of mass shooting Israel is doing mass bombardment
I think most people who call them Nazis are doing so because of the mindset. Israel is forced to exercise a modicum of restraint while Nazis had none at all, but their actions and rhetoric are extremely similar. Not saying no one thinks the IDF is doing things on a similar scale to the Holocaust (I did until like five minutes ago), but that’s not really the reason for the comparison. “If it looks like a Nazi, walks like a Nazi and quacks like a Nazi, it’s a Nazi” is a pretty logically sound line of thinking.
To repeat myself just in case, the Nazis’ industrialization of death was on a level on its own that hopefully won’t be repeated again, but the Lebensraum aspect of Nazi ideology is replicated almost exactly as a core tenet of Zionist thinking. This is why they’re called Nazis.
I had actually been trying to think of a truely unpopular opinion, and it finally hit me to post this. Its a shame i dont know how to fully explain my deep hatred but the general idea is all thats needed for an unpopular opinion lol.
I get that and I think it’s in the spirit of unpopular opinions. It’s actually interesting how divisive this topic is. I think in my circles I have an equally unpopular opinion of the exact opposite stance which is that war happens and atrocities come out of it and picking sides in the middle east is a fools errand. I think israel was dealt a shit hand where their existence comes at the displacement of Palestinians, they have holocaust trauma and then their neighbors want them dead, and then they are given superior fire power. How is that recipe going to play out? But I know emotions are high and there has to be a “right” side and a good guy and a bad guy.