Calls are growing for the UN Security Council to be reformed after the US became the only member to use its veto power to block a Gaza ceasefire resolution, a move welcomed by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. The UN chief says he will keep pushing for peace.
Nothing changed on the UNSC when Russia vetoed the resolution to leave Ukraine.
I’m not educated enough to say which is a “worse” violation of the principles the UN stands for, but I’ll go out on a limb and say nothing will change this time, either.
Yes, the whole idea of countries being able to veto UN resolutions are leading to exactly this, Russia vetoing all resolutions condemning their aggression in Ukraine and the US vetoing all resolutions concerning Israel.
I’m not sure how a resolution condemning anything is helpful, and I don’t know why Israel and Hamas need the UN for a cease fire.
The “resolution” the UN needs to come to here, in my opinion, is to put the whole area (Israel and Palestine) under UN control until something equitable can be worked out.
UN control is notorious for not working out well, and liking children too much.
Not working out well compared to what’s happening now? And you think children are being protected from anything now?
No, of course not. There is just a very poor reputation for UN Peace keeping forces, so giving them martial law in one of the most contested places in the world might not end any better.
I’m not educated enough to say which is a “worse” violation of the principles the UN stands for, but I’ll go out on a limb and say nothing will change this time, either.
Russia wants to annex a country. Israel is fighting a terrorist group. Russia is worse.
Russia wants to annex a country. Israel is fighting a terrorist group.
Isreal has been slowly annexing bits of Palestine for decades. Those terrorists are the latest reaction to that.
Not that their violence against Israel is a good thing - far from it, but it’s also not surprising.
Isreal has been slowly annexing bits of Palestine for decades.
They literally haven’t. Gaza’s borders are unchanged.
And what do you call the Israeli “settlements”?
Israeli settlements are literally built on Israeli land. East Jerusalem and the Golan Heights were won in the Six Day War.
So… If Russia “wins” parts of Ukrainian territory, it’s all valid?
The 6 Day War was a bit more complicated than a blatant land grab
In a realpolitik sense, yeah probably. That’s why Ukraine needs to win. Nothing is going to happen to Russia if they crush Ukraine underfoot. Do you really believe something is?
More to the point, though, the Six Day War was a defensive war by Israel in which other countries willfully abdicated territory for Israel’s security purposes. It was not a war of annexation, so the two are completely different things.
Note these settlements are on the other side of the Israeli border after the 1967 war, making a large percentage of the West Bank de facto Israeli territory. And it continues to shrink.
I’d call them not in Gaza…
Genocide is obviously worse than annexation. One just wants the land, the other wants to kill everyone on it too. Israel is far more evil than Russia.
That said nothing will change indeed.
Russia is committing genocide. They’re both evil. Israel has been doing it for longer and is better at it.
Russia is not out to kill all Ukrainians. They are annexing (stealing) land. They want land and then want to assimilate the Ukrainians into their country. (which is bad I’m not condoning Russia here)
Israel wants to kill all the people living on the land and replace them with their own race.
This is not nearly the same
“Forced assimilation” is one way to commit genocide. Another is through holocaust. The Holocaust happened to be genocide via holocaust. Gaza happens to be genocide via holocaust. The definition of genocide doesn’t require it be committed via holocaust.
Edit: fixed an autoincorrect
Giza happens to be genocide via holocaust. The definition of genocide doesn’t require it be committed via holocaust.
The Pharoah must step in!
And the award for the clueless, most unnecessary joke, goes to you. You do understand that not everything requires a shitty take at humor? Your comment brings nothing to the thread, OP has already fixed their mistake. Why are you here?
I’m here to annoy humorless cunts
and then want to assimilate the Ukrainians into their country
Textbook genocide. The erasure of a group of people is genocide. That can be done by:
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Ethnic cleansing and mass killings (as demonstrated by piles of bodies in Mariupol I believe, as well as mobile crematoriums)
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Kidnapping the group’s children (again, loudly and proudly admitted to by Russia) to deny the future of the group
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Forcible assimilation by preventing the group from practicing it’s culture and identity (as demonstrated by Putin saying Ukraine is actually Russian because it’s historically part of the Russian empire)
There’s one more, that I pray isn’t being used and I think we’d have heard if it was. Rape can be used as a weapon of war to force the group to give birth to your children, and deny their future in that way. To my knowledge Russia does not have a campaign to do so with Ukrainians, thank God.
A lot of the tactics Russia is using aren’t new either, look into Russification by the USSR to Eastern Europe. They would envelop states into the USSR after purposely growing a Russian population there with settlers. This is the big reason why Eastern Europe tends to hate Russia.
as demonstrated by Putin saying Ukraine is actually Russian because it’s historically part of the Russian empire
Funny that he says “Russian Empire”, because Russia hasn’t been an Empire since Tsar Nicholas II. Is he trying to go back to those days, like try to install himself as Tsar?
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Israel wants to kill all the people living on the land and replace them with their own race.
If that was a thing they actually wanted, they’d be doing a really shitty job of it.
Which will be vetoed by all permanent members of the security council.
The problem in this case is depending on the security council to act on an issue it isn’t designed to address.
The main purpose of the UN is to prevent global war, and the Security Council is the primary way in which that goal is achieved.
In that context, the P5’s veto power makes sense. It prevents resolutions pitting the world against one of the superpowers that can sustain that kind of war.
American here, I support this call.
I mean, same. The ability of certain blocs to railroad the UN is obscene. We should protect our veto tho
We should protect our veto
The countries that currently have a veto make less sense the way the world is developing.
France and the UK have a veto, but Germany doesn’t? China has a veto but India doesn’t?
I get that it’s based on historic disputes after the war, but it doesn’t fit the current world well.
If the UN isn’t reformed, there’s nothing stopping these rising states from starting their own UN
from
startingignoring their ownUN
Our veto is the problem here. Vetoes in general are the problem.
Because of “one nation one vote,” it is trivially easy for the more hardcore Muslim bloc or authoritarian nations to shove things through that should absolutely not be shoved through.
And basing it off population would essentially give China and India the power to vote themselves whatever they wanted. It’s the US legislative problem all over again and do we really want one world government in the end?
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Nobody is surprised and that’s a bad sign. The UN was invented to give the nations of our world a shared forum to talk things out and find a “resolution” before genociding each other. The thing is we can’t expect the UN to stop conflict.
Edit: Some people seem to confuse the UN security council with the UN. The SC has only 15 members (5 permanent member nations, 10 rotating member nations) and is usually asked to vote on intervention once a resolution was passed. It can’t act with a veto.
If the UN was serious about promoting peace, they’d have occupied Gaza themselves over a decade ago.
This vote, like all votes, is political. It’s not for some higher purpose
Or even better, come up with a solution that’s more than “unconditional ceasfire right now, you figure out the rest”. How is any country supposed to follow that.
Besides, the UN shits on Israel as a pastime, that should be the first thing addressed in a UN reform.
Which is hilarious because this split state was basically created by them. Anyone could see the tensions as a result of it and the only reason that Israel wasn’t pushed out on multiple occasions was they won. They exist because they ignored the UN beyond the initial state creation.
To be fair, it’s the same countries that ignored the UN’s resolution to create the two states and instead went to war against Israel that are also the cause of the constant petty resolutions against Israel. The system was broken from day 1.
There shouldn’t be a security council
It’s less a council of nations who actively keep the world secure, but moreso a council to keep the world secure from those nations. The security council is there so the world’s most dangerous countries don’t just go to war, and it makes them maintain a dialogue.
It’s unfortunately functioning as needed. The vetoes may piss others off, but it keeps them at the table. The ability to veto anything is a great incentive to stick around.
How are they supposed to cater to the MIC if some random bunch of countries can cut off their markets like that?
Israel only exists in its current form because the advocate for the original UN plan was assassinated by a zionist terrorist. Israel was born an enemy of the UN.
How about we disband the Disunited Abominations?
We don’t need UN.
This is far from perfect, even far from functional at times. But without it we don’t have a forum. Without a forum, how do you deal with adversaries? It’s not words… This UN is better than no UN
We could save so much money if we just disbanded the UN.
I used to think the same way. But with UN, at least someone “official” has a responsibility to “raise the voice”. It is better than nothing, I guess.
And how is that going for us? The Middle East doing fine now?
Why do you think it would not be worse without the UN?
Do you think this is the only thing the UN does? Or that everything else it does does not matter?
I think they spend a lot of money and park in handicapped spots.
We got an edgy one here. No one get cut
Got an argument go ahead and make it.
Because your argument of taking up parking spaces is so worth debating lol
You’ve made the same point about parking twice in these comments now, got anything else to add
The UK and the US voluntarily walked in to that. Multiple times. That has less than nothing to do with the UN.
I see. So the UN has had no impact on the region?
Just because it isn’t 100% effective that doesn’t mean it has no impact.
Right just one identical to not existing
You’re welcome to move to Russia any time you want
In the global scheme of things the UN is so fucking cheap. I can’t understand your point at all.
Those parking spaces must be worth thousands of dollars!
Don’t you think it would be possible to just operate it more cheaply?
Or have some conception as to its value? I mean we could save so much money if we never paid for anything. And yet we do pay for things. The question is, why? If we could save money by never paying for anything, why not?
Oh right. Things have value.
Yeah but like, what’s the ‘value’ in their expensive forums? I’m sure there is a lot of fat to trim that only exists so the public servants get to live like kings.
