- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
Applicants for German citizenship will be required to explicitly affirm Israel’s right to exist under a new citizenship law which came into effect on Tuesday.
The new law shortened the number of years that a person must have lived in Germany in order to obtain a passport, from eight to five years. It will also allow first-generation migrants to be dual citizens.
As part of the shake-up, new questions were added to the country’s citizenship test, including about Judaism and Israel’s right to exist.
You must log in or register to comment.
What kinda fascist, authoritarian bullshit is this? I’m seriously considering giving up my German citizenship (I also hold citizenship in another EU country that recognizes Palestine) because of this. Although I would regularly have to go to the consulate for administrative tasks like renewing my ID, it would be worth it.
Edit: I am a firm supporter of a two-state solution, but one of the two states is not interested in that whatsoever. It is the exact state that is ruled by an antidemocratic, fascist, ethno-supremacist government, which is constantly murdering innocent civilians. Israel has a right to the 1947 territory set by the UN. But not a single square centimeter more than that.
So by definition, no, I don’t recognize the current form of the Israeli state, which claims the entire Palestinian territory.
The question doesn’t ask if you support the current state of Israel though.
Maybe the last sentence is hard to see because it’s under the picture, but I clearly wrote:
So by definition, no, I don’t recognize the current form of the Israeli state, which claims the entire Palestinian territory.
I explained the reasoning behind this stance in my previous comment.
I specifically responded to your last sentence. If you are OK with for example Israel in the UN recognised borders of 1947, then you don’t deny the right of the state of Israel to exist, which is all that is being asked for.
The current Israeli state defines itself as holding all of the territory. I do not recognize that state. The current form of the Israeli state is not suitable for a peaceful solution to the problems in the region. I don’t think that the idea of an Israeli state should be completely abolished, but it must not try to occupy more territory than was planned by the UN in 1947. Until then, I can’t take these terrorists seriously.
I actually read the new law, and it doesn’t seem that bad. I haven’t found a single question that directly requires an applicant to recognize the state of Israel, but there are some questions that involve Israel and kinda require that someone at least acknowledges the existence of Israel, in order to answer them.
The majority of European antisémites have zero problem with the existence of Israel “out there”. They are more than happy to see the Jews leave Europe for the middle east. American antisémites are fantasizing that Israel will be the site of the Second Coming of Christ who will then turn all the Jews into Christians.
This observation alone should tell you everything about why it is stupid and wrong to use attitudes towards Israel as proxy measures for attitudes towards Jews. When the antisémites pass your metric with flying colours whereas Jewish anti-Zionists fail it, your metric is just shit, simple as that.
To be honest, countries don’t have right to exists countries don’t have rights. Rights are inneherently for humans. It’s a stupid notion, countries are established by violence and their borders are enforced through violence, it means that Israel or any country has the right to use violence against those whom they judge to threaten their existence. And that includes the population of said country, if the people of country A decides one day to become country B, they can’t because country A has a right to exist but not the none-existing country B.
And that seems to be the crux of this whole mess. We conflate Jews the ethnicity, Jews the religion, Israelis, the Israel state and the Israeli government, and you either accept that the whole package is totally just, or you’re an antisemit…
The zionists felt threatened again
You know what gives a nation a right to exist? Motherfucking steel.
^Has not solved the riddle
All good ideas but what does that actually change? It’s just a signature on a paper.
Exist? Okay sure, why not.
Bomb a Population to a pulp? FUCK NO!
And thats why I will NEVER vote for any of these fucks again! My Party won’t make it into the Bundestag? I DON’T CARE! Because the other Party’s won’t represent me anyway, so I can easily vote for my small Party which at least represents me! 💜
Exist? Okay sure, why not.
Uh, maybe because they exist on stolen land, taken from Palestinians by force?
Okay, What would be the alternative then? Destroy the State of Israel and drive out Millions of People, guilty and innocent alike, again?
Would that make this whole situation better? You can’t replace injustice with injustice.
I mean maybe Israel should stop their genocide and, I dunno, try to peacefully coexist and maybe return the fucking stolen homes to their owners? Yeah, some Israelis may need to leave. That’s on their government for establishing an apartheid state and then attempting genocide to keep it rather than try to live in peace and harmony with Palestinians.
Okay. And now read my Comment again.
Exist = ok.
Bomb a Population to a pulp (genocide) = Fuck No.
This is a good decision. Antisemitism is on the rise in Germany. 4782 antisemitic incidents in 2023, which is 83% more than the year before. 58% of these incidents occured after Oct 7.
While I don’t doubt that more Germans are becoming more antisemitic, promoting zionism does not combat antisemitism. Lord Balfor (of the Balfor Declaration), was extremely antisemitic. He was very explicit about how removing jews from Britain and getting a shiny new colony were both positives.
But also that statistic is useless because a significant number people arrested in Germany for antisemitism since Oct 7 were Jews protesting against Israel.
That article you linked does not contain anything controversial. No shit, “from the river to the sea” is forbidden in Germany and attending a forbidden demonstration where crimes are conducted has the risk of being detained.
She was released shortly afterwards but says: “I didn’t think I would get detained for that – I was naive it turns out.”
Don’t act like people end up in prison here for criticizing the state of Israel. People get detained for a couple of hours in the context of demonstrations all the time. Stop derailing, the article from the Qatari news agency you linked does not add anything here.
no shit, “from the river to the sea” is forbidden in Germany
You understand why this is fucked up right? Is it also forbidden to say “Hawaii will be free” or “Free Tibet”?
From the river to the sea is not forbidden in Germany. There are several court rulings on this. Ironically, when Netanyahu wants a Jewish ethnostate from the river to the sea, that is perfectly fine for the same people who erroneously claim that saying „ From the river to the sea“ would be forbidden to say.
These statistic say little as the German police does not properly distinguish between antisemitism and anti-zionism.
But regardless, if you are so extreme in your views that you can’t accept the existence of the state of Israel in some shape or form, you are probably not a good fit for German society.
I’m not sure what you want to imply here. I do not see the benefit in asking the offender why they beat up the Jewish person.
I cited numbers from a study by RIAS (Wiki, German), this is not from a police statistic.
The study distinguishes Isreal-related antisemitism, meaning the incidents were directed against the Jewish state of Israel and denied its legitimacy. This kind of antisemitism was 52%.
Incidence does not mean “beating up” someone. Spray painting “stop the genocide in Gaza” is sometimes counted as an “antisemitic incidence” in Germany.
I wonder what definition of antisemitism they use
