Only one in 10 feel leaving the EU has helped their finances, while just 9% say it has benefited the NHS, despite £350m a week pledge according to new poll
A clear majority of the British public now believes Brexit has been bad for the UK economy, has driven up prices in shops, and has hampered government attempts to control immigration, according to a poll by Opinium to mark the third anniversary of the UK leaving the EU single market and customs union.
The survey of more than 2,000 UK voters also finds strikingly low numbers of people who believe that Brexit has benefited them or the country.
Just one in 10 believe leaving the EU has helped their personal financial situation, against 35% who say it has been bad for their finances, while just 9% say it has been good for the NHS, against 47% who say it has had a negative effect.
Nothing good in human history has ever come from conservatism. Nothing at all.
You mean a backwards looking ideology doesn’t address the needs of society today and in the future?
Even calling it “backwards” is falling for conservatives’ euphemistic lie. Conservatism has never really been about “upholding tradition” or any of the bullshit they claim; it’s only ever been about authoritarianism and enforcing hierarchy. If it happens to jive with a “tradition” it is only because said tradition is authoritarian and hierarchical.
It’s never really been conservatism, it’s regressivism. They want Feudalism because they think they can be king.
“Conservatism” has always been a euphemism for regressivism. There is no difference between the two concepts, and never was.
To say that “it’s never really been conservatism,” as if there’s a distinction to be made between the abhorrent ideology of conservatives like Trump and some kind of other non-abhorrent version of conservatism, is to be an apologist for it. It’s understandable that you’d make such an error since conservatives spend a lot of effort trying to gaslight the public and launder the reputation of conservative ideology, but nevertheless, the notion that there exists (or has ever existed) some idealized form of conservatism that isn’t thoroughly regressive garbage remains a fallacy.
Yep. There is value in looking at how things are currently done and have been done in the past. There’s no need to reinvent the wheel, and there may have been good reason for some decisions in the past. We had a safety system at work that had some superfluous quirks, but when we went to remove them, we learned the customer had specifically requested it to be that way. On the other end, we learned that we had some poorly designed equipment because we had specifically requested it in the past.
None of that though is what modern conservatives do.
None of that though is what
modernconservatives do.FTFY. Half the point I was trying to make is that the notion about conservatism being about acting with caution isn’t just a lie now, but has always been one. Conservatives have been falsely claiming this ever since the 16th Century!
Fair, yeah. We need a different term for the ideology to separate it from conservatism.
No we don’t.
I think I still haven’t quite made myself understood: The version of conservatism centered around perpetuating social hierarchy is conservatism. We don’t need another name for it because it’s the only kind of conservatism there ever was. The “good” kind of conservatism that’s about caution or moderation that folks keep trying to contrast it with also doesn’t need a name because it’s not actually a thing that exists as a distinct ideology. (I suppose if you really insist on labeling it, you could call it “not-conservatism.”)
Everybody who claims to be the “good” kind of conservative is either (a) a trash conservative who is lying about their motivations, or (b) a confused non-conservative.
What’s the name of the distinct ideology? I completely agree though.
conservatism
Putin worked hard to promote conservative agendas in UK, U.S. and France, to degrade those countries. It worked in all but France.
Yet… Far right is on the highway to the next election
Agreed! France really impresses me. The people there are strong-willed and don’t put up with bullshit. I found myself cheering for them all year this year.
Gosh, if ONLY SOMEONE WOULD HAVE WARNED PEOPLE that brexit was a terrible idea tossed together by fear mongering, self interested dickheads!!! If only someone had mentioned it was a terrible idea ahead of time!
Also if only more than 24% of the voters could have been arsed to vote.
I voted against it, still annoyed.
The vote was cursory, it was not supposed to be binding.
Absolutely. Like in the brexit referendum of 2016, which had a 72% turnout. Not like that referendum you are referencing, which is… Which one exactly?
It’s not like remainers ever put up a convincing argument prior to losing the referendum.
Turned voting age on the referendum, visited our predominantly working class school, only ever brought up cheaper phone calls abroad as to why they should vote to remain.
Brexit only had pull out the weakest reasons to leave becuase they were the only ones who took the referendum seriously.
The reality is that there were a thousand paths back from that cliff. The vote was no binding, and barely a majority. If the British public wanted to halt it they could have just elected non-leave politicians in the years afterwards, but they didn’t.
The problem was that nobody in the UK did an effective job of arguing for remain. They were caught napping because they were convinced that people wouldn’t want to leave.
When they realised that we were in danger of voting to leave it was too late.
Obviously, people in the EU said that it was a bad idea but they obviously would say that because we’re “sending them £350 million a week” and they wouldn’t want to lose that.
Everyone saw this coming but still decided to walk off the cliff rather than admit they’d made a bad decision
“What we believe shapes who we are. Belief can bring us salvation or destruction. But when you believe a lie for too long, the truth doesn’t set you free. It tears you apart.”
I spent the first twenty years of my life believing that every piece of gum you swallow stays in you forever 🪦
Pootin and the GRU/IRA were behind the effort mostly waged on social media
Around 35% of the total population actually voted for it, and even then, those people weren’t the ones who decided to push forward despite it clearly being a shit show.
Blame the people responsible, I’m so sick of this lazy “everyone” blanket statements people make about events that have very specific individuals and institutions to blame, all it’s doing is literally letting them get away with it.
That was clear too, but Conservatives still won a majority and expectedly squashed any chance of a second referendum. We can’t absolve ourselves of all blame when democracy is still a functional tool we have at our disposal. Now even democracy itself is under attack all around the world, and I’m afraid that “not my fault” mentality will become a self-fulfilling prophecy.
They did not win a majority.
365 out of 650 seats, 56% majority. It was a record win for them.
Eh only 43% of the vote though. It’s just FPTP that cause the majority in the house of commons. It wasn’t exactly a binding win for Brexit considering the parties pushing for either remaining or another referendum won more votes overall. Plus a big part of it was a vote against Corbyn, rather than a vote for Brexit.
General elections are too general to be used as justification for a single policy IMO.
Yes this analysis was clear as day even before the referendum passed. The only amazing thing here is that 10% still think it has helped. Wow.
10% is actually amazingly low. I’ve said it before, 25% of any population, any country and time period is dumb as a bag of rocks. So no matter what you’ll always have 25% mouthbreathers. Here even 15% of them realized they’ve been had!
I wouldn’t say everyone, at least. The vote was actually very close, which I think is something most of us forget at this point.
They used the wrong kind of referendum given the seriousness of the question, it should have required a significant majority consensus, instead it was just a “who got more votes even if it just one more”.
The results showed a deeply divided nation, and we still are. Some brexiters do regret their terrible decision, but I don’t forgive them. There was ample information, experts, everything showing what a terrible disastrous idea Brexit was, and they voted for it anyway.
This wasn’t some shades of grey issue, it was surprisingly black and white for once, haha. Which makes it all the more strange that so many people still voted to deeply damage the nation and their own futures.
Oh, and one other point just because I think we often forget, the referendum wasn’t at all binding. The government could have simply said “We’ve taken your thoughts into consideration but decided to do what’s best for the country and stay in the EU, even if this will hurt our political careers. Our duty is to the nation, above even our own careers”.
They…did not say that :-( Instead they got theirs, at all our expenses.
Actually only half of all people saw the obvious downsides. The other half said “nuh uh it’ll be great, way better in fact” with no evidence or facts and folks went with that.
All of the last decade, and most of the last 2, has been calamitous for Great Britain. Brexit is just one on a list of crippling blows dealt to its population.
- NHS, gone
- Home ownership, gone
- Europe, gone
- Education, gone
- wages, gone
- environment- going
- civil rights - going
With no prospect of any of them coming back .
All sold to neoliberalism.
The NHS, wages and civil rights were all on the chopping block of the Tories for decades, and people still voted for them in droves.
Because across the board big and little “c” conservatives place money/profit above all else.
But at least the immigrants have all disappeared! Right?!
It’s funny cause I’m here as an imigrant but leaving cause the place is going to shit. So, success?
Ironically one of the only ways forward for them is to open up immigration to more people. GDP is going to be permanently lower unless they go heavy automation like Japan (requiring a lot of capital that is going to be a lot more expensive post-Brexit), or let a lot more people in.
And the problem with heavy automation, as Japan is finding, is that machines and robots don’t generate the income tax revenue needed to pay for an aging population. Hence Japan is finding it necessary to allow more immigration.
To be fair, a lot of places have these exact problems nowadays.
NHS stands for National Health Service.
Just like most informed people predicted.
You should go crawling on your knees and beg the EU to take you back, and farage, rees-mogg and boris should pay for the entire thing.
My hot take: the EU is better off without them. Britain has always been a belligerent holier than thou obstacle to progress for the EU, even after they got a sweetheart deal that NO OTHER European nation got offered.
Let them rot on their island while the rest of Europe actually makes progress.
Yup. If the EU takes them back, it should be with HEAVY scrutiny and no sweetheart deals. You wanna fuck around? Time to find out.
Pretty sure it was already said that if they ever want back, they get treated as any other country trying to get in. No special treatment
First up, make them adopt the Euro.
Removed by mod
That’s like a couple getting married again after a divorce. It HAS happened, but only when both people are lost together in a world of mutual crazy that neither can live outside. I don’t think the EU is participating in the Uk’s fantasy world, so it’ll never happen.
Nah. The honest truth is that the EU doesn’t care that much about the UK.
It’s much more like someone storming out their local pub and refusing to come back. It’s a big deal to the guy that left, but a much smaller deal to everyone still drinking in the pub.
If the UK stops acting like a dick and pays for their share they’d be eventually welcome back, once it looked like they’d actually learnt their lesson and wouldn’t do it again. The real barriers to rejoining are on the UK side. No one wants to reopen that can of worms.
UK had one of the larger militarys in the EU. Only reason I can see them ever considering it.
Aren’t most of the EU also NATO members? I guess I’ve never thought much about the military aspects of the EU.
I think your analogy is not a 1:1 representation of the situation at hand.
Oh? Well, don’t leave us hanging. Why do you think that?
Do you think your analogy is a 1:1 representation of the situation at hand? Lol.
Look. If you’re not prepared to actually discuss and share your ideas, why comment at all? And don’t go putting the burden on me to invalidate the opinion you just dropped, raw, and walked away from.
Do you think everyone on the internet is worth arguing with?
I just asked you a simple yes or no question.
Certainly you’ve proven not to be worth talking to at all.
Gives middle finger to biggest trading partner by far.
Surprised Pikachu face when economy goes to hell.
I cannot fathom the thought process of the Regrexiters.
It makes sense when you frame Brexit in the context of “we don’t like brown people”. They weren’t thinking about the economy. Never were.
Kinda. A lot of them had this very strong opinion that they were basically an economic powerhouse and were actually better off without the trades that were lopsided against them. They’re learning how trade power actually works.
Which is funny because they have a much smaller GDP then Germany, and only slightly bigger than France.
I would wager it comes from a history of being a trade powerhouse. I’m no expert, though.
No shit, Sherlock.
IF the UK rejoins the EU at any time in the future, we will certainly never have the preferential terms and disproportionate power that we’d originally had. Defacto not as good as a deal. However, STILL much better to be part of the EU than to be circling the drain as we are right now.
I am still furious about Brexit on a personal level. Freedom of movement was amazing. It meant that I could just decide to go live and work in an EU country whenever I wanted. I had previously used this to spend a couple of years in Spain and maybe a year in France. I’d been planning a move to Portugal when Brexit took this away from me. All those opportunities gone because of dumb fuckers who didn’t even realise we had them. Ignorant bigoted wankers. Goes without saying I voted remain. I’d be delighted to rejoin, and if it means we adopt the euro that’s fine with me. It won’t happen for at least a decade though, and at my age that’ll be too late for me.
No, they realised that they had the freedom of movement. The Brexit vote was in part to punish people like you because you still had that freedom.
And getting rid of the unfair preferential terms is good for the EU as a whole, because it will reduce resentment in all other current and potential future member nations.
Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely believe Brexit hurt everyone in Europe and I can’t wait to welcome UK back into the Union, but make it on equal terms. It’s a very small silver lining to the whole fiasco. I just hope it doesn’t take too long for UK to find a leader string enough to say “I think we made a mistake, we should reapply”. Make a new referendum while the populace still realizes the connection between Brexit and the current misery before some populist schmuck finds a new scapegoat.
Agree completely. The old arrangements were compromises to get the original deal dome. That was half a century ago and a lot has changed.
I think it’s best for the EU if the UK doesn’t have preferential treatment.
To me, I never understood the desire to leave. Even the people who being talking heads for Brexit actively benefitied financially from UKs position in the EU. The choice to leave was roused up on a bunch half truths and bold face lies to scare the the general public of hatining anything south of the channel… Despite getting so much benefit.
Smartest thing they could do is beg their way back into the EU and claw back what ever benefits they had enjoyed like stated above there is no scenario where UK ends up good as they were back in 2016 let alone in a better bargaining position, but they also don’t have to throw away their future prosperity based on stubborn pride.
It’s hysteria.
but they also don’t have to throw away their future prosperity based on stubborn pride.
Lol, but they will.
Want it said that if the UK rejoined then they’d have to go on the Euro?
If and when UK is allowed back in, this time they will not be offered all of the opt-outs!
Welcome, Schengen and Euro!
That would be nice for Ireland, we could finally join Schengen which is currently out of the question because of the open border with Northern Ireland.
Maybe it’s finally time for northern island to jump ship
I’m not an economist, but what I have seen is the decline in the value of Sterling since Brexit as well of the downgrading of the UK credit rating. Even if we adopt the Euro, the value of the same goods will still vary between different countries. However, the same silly arguments will arise again saying that the is EU taking over.
Everyone says this, but I think the EU wants Britain back in enough to make some exceptions again. The way I look at it is that it doesn’t hurt to try.
Eh, willing to bet that Germany wants to set a precedent that they, and no one else, like France, can just leave and rejoin on a political far right whim.
It sounds like cooperation works better than unnecessary contention. Who would have guessed.
The ruling class, which is why they fight cooperation among workers.
Imagine voting against Scottish Independence then getting fucked out of the EU immediately afterwards by Brexit.
Britain is Europe’s America.
Europeans would be wise to distance themselves from them.
Any sane person would have seen this outcome coming. The leavers were still stuck in the Victorian Era with their mentality.
You say that but people still want to vote for Trump. This kind of jingoistic populism is doing pretty well right around the globe right now
Some wanted to be spiteful. Not sure to whom though
No fucking shit.
I’m still in disbelief at racist ignorant Tory cunts that voted for this.
Fuck them and their political apathy.
Fuck them and their complete disregard for factual information.
They can now lie in the bed they made, the absolute fools.
Murdoch holds a lot of the blame as well, without that prick taking sides in his newspapers it would never have happened
I hope you can all work to get Tory shit out of your government
And fuck the fucking fucks!! Fuck you, you fuck! You BIG fuck! You massive, whopping, FUCK!
Oh gee. Who coulda seen that coming, huh?
Glad it happened, though. The total clown show of Brexit very quickly shut up all the Anti-EU trolls.
Oh gee. Who coulda seen that coming, huh?
Only 48% of the country…
And something like 80% of the rest of the world (No source, made it the fuck up :))
98.6% of statistics posted on the internet are made up.
Reading this in a Minnesotan accent. Ah jeez! Who coulda seen this coming, ha, hon? They really, well, they shot themselves damn near in the foot, didn’t they now? Don’cha know the Eurapeans want to help you now, but these racists ya see, racism always gets in the way of peace. That’s what my mother always said.
I genuinely asking for some education on Brexit, because I personally thought, and still think it was a terrible decision for the nation, but I am hoping to get a better understanding from real people and not just read articles. I know I can research it, but would like to hear personal opinions/thoughts/etc….
I am a UK citizen, but I was living my teen and mid adult life in Australia. I didn’t get to vote on Brexit as I was not residing on the country at the time, and never thought I would return. Circumstances have changed, and I have now moved back to the UK at the beginning of the year, so I’m in the thick of the Brexit mess now. I can’t comment on what life was like before Brexit, but I am now a citizen of its consequences.
From my limited understanding, and what I really need clarification and advice on is;
Brexit was a campaign point that David Cameron ran on for election. When he won, he called the referendum, but he was opposed to it. Meanwhile, the Brexit campaign was in full swing with lots of misinformation, but Cameron only decided to rally hard in the leading three months up to the vote, failing to properly educate and explain the deal to the public.
The vote was close. Somewhere in the 52%/48%
Cameron stood down
Brexit happened, finalising at the end of 2020
I know there’s a lot of nuance, and I know I’m missing a lot of major information, but is my understanding the very basic gist of what happened?
Thanks for any response
From a continental EU country, I can tell you that Brexit was a shitshow from beginning to the end. The Leave campaign was clearly helped by the same Russian bots that helped Trump get the US presidency. Then, May added confusion to the shock and frustration. People kept saying lies, like it is possible to keep the common market benefits while cherry picking which regulation to follow. Then came Johnson and his lunatic demands, like creating an independent judicial body that would rule any future disagreement on the deal between UK and the EU. Then the constant whining and bullying about fisheries and goods transportation. The UK had been a beacon of hope, heart and decency for the whole 20st Century. Brexit has made it a sinister clown in Europe.
Thank you for comment. These points you mention really illustrate the absolute clusterfuck it has become.
Annoyingly, I believe in democracy and can’t get angry that it happened. It went to the people. The people voted. But damn it was a joke from the beginning, full of lies and deception. Sadly the UK citizens are suffering from this, but hopefully things get better sooner. I’ll always be the eternal optimist.
Good for you mate!
I was with you till this.
The UK had been a beacon of hope, heart and decency for the whole 20st Century.
You drop this gem of satire in between your serious post
Yeah, that’s about right. And now the Brits are paying the price.
