- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- world@lemmy.world
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Normally I’m tepid on this kinda headline getting, but I feel like Stonehenge of all things is not the ideal target for the supposed intent of these kinds of protests.
I have the suspicion for a while that the people behind those new climate movements are paid by oil companies and others to make climate activists look bad, and shift the public opinion about climate action.
All the actions seem to deliberately targeted to anger the mainstream about them.
Making the naive climate activists at the front the tool of conglomerates.
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Idk man, sometimes reality is stranger than fiction. Like wasn’t there reporting about the US recently in which the military was spreading antivax misinformation in the Philippines and other countries. Russia and China has their own cyber armies too. It’s not too much of a stretch that large conglomerates and corpos may have their own private propaganda wings either.
You’re not wrong.
I also saw some evidence further down this thread that oil companies provide funding to this group that I had previously been unaware of. I deleted my comment shortly after that but it might still be showing up because federation can be screwy.
Hmmm, I would keep an open mind though. It’s not like these oil companies are dumb. They know that their reputation is bad. Slip a few million into the pockets of their enemies and “leak” information that they “the big baddies” are funding these seemingly unlikeable people, and that would likely slowly damage their reputation beyond repair. Although that may just be some light conspiracism on my part.
Edit Addendum: I do think that whatever actions that just stop oil has done are ultimately harmless to whatever object they “”“”“vandalize”“”“”. Their actions are very good at getting public attention on climate change, and maybe even boosting donations to less radical climate activist groups.
Why not? They used starch. It’s not like Stonehenge is actually damaged. And using symbols people care about is the only way to convey that the crisis we’re facing is actually threatening things we care about. Everything else will be, and has been, ignored.
Because it was built by Naturepath druids.
They vandalized a structure that represents the purest distillment europeans may have achieved of their ideal vision thus far in human history.
That’d be like me demanding bike infrastructure by bombing Amsterdam.
I’m not sure I’d describe practitioners of human sacrifice in quite the same way, myself.
It was the Bronze and Iron age, even the people who swore they didn’t do human sacrifice had sneaky backdoor rituals that played out human sacrifice, cough cough Romans cough cough
Off to the bog with you
It’s all about attention
Rebecca Watson has an interesting video on this. The way things are going right now, people in 50 years will look back and say activists were the only people trying something, while most of us just waited for the shit to hit the fan.
Is cornstarch paint?
By that logic, could water be considered paint?
No. But it does make for a good shitty click bait title.
You mean like water colours?
Fuck these people.
Obligatory Astroturfing warning.
yeah? why?
They didn’t destroy anything, the paint can be removed without ruining the site, and they brought more visibility than sitting around with signs.
I don’t have a problem with this.
I’m not sure visibility is really what we need at this point. Is there anyone left on Earth that doesn’t know about it? I think what we need instead is political mobilization and coalition-building to increase our political clout and ultimately win elections and create legislation.
Yeah I think awareness where they ruin yachts and private planes is better than destroying common cultural heritage. Wtf
Ah but you see then JustStopOil’s millionaire founder might have his expensive toys damaged then.
Maybe it’s that this is a better a metaphor for the destruction of the common cultural heritage of the environment? Not many people can relate to or are inconvenienced by a very expensive private boat sinking.
Apparently everyone still doesn’t get how serious it is if they get worked up over paint on Stonehenge more than over the climate catastrophy.
The assumption that people think problems need to be solved is just that, an assumption. Conservatives believe in tradition, where problems do not get fixed. Fixing problems = bad, because fixes are changes from tradition.
Most people are somewhere on a scale between conservative and progressive though. But you certainly don’t want to just assume most people want things fixed, it’s unfortunately just not true. It’s just projecting progressive personality traits onto people that have less of them for whatever reason.
So no, not apparently. It’s much, much worse than simple ignorance.
Imagine they spray painted your car and then somebody said why are you mad about your car when the environment is fucked.
I don’t have a car.
And took a job that pays less than other offers, cause it’s within bicycle distance from my home, which I chose cause it’s in a bike-friendly area.
I know the impact is low, but at least I’m not part of the problem. I don’t think I could cut down on my CO2 any more while still living in society.Okay imagine somebody vandalized your bike and then said you shouldn’t be complaining when the environment is fucked.
I really don’t understand what point you’re trying to make here.
They don’t vandalize the property of private citizens.
Their critics say they should (spray paint private jets instead of rocks).This is more like “what if someone vandalized the scenic rock formation I can see from my bedroom window”.
And if they spray painted a message about fightng the climate catastrophy on it, I’d love it.
The amount of people justifying calling it global warming is still is kinda shocking to be honest. The ignorance is probably why people are still bringing kt to light.
Theres people in the comments saying it causes warming and that’s why they call it that……
The amount of people justifying calling it global warming is still is kinda shocking to be honest.
I was told for decades by activists and global leaders it was global warming. For example, An Inconvenient Truth says global warming dozens of times. Are you now telling me those people were wrong?
Yes, it’s propaganda lmfao. Wow.
The term warming is used to detract from the truth, this is shocking how few people understand this simple concept used to create propaganda. And the public perpetuates it.
It’s been climate change for decades as well, you’re just eating into the politics like most people here.
Then it’s a good thing you’re not in charge of maintaining and preserving Stonehenge.
I know “there is no bad press” but more people will think “fuck those guys” than “maybe environment does need saving” upon reading these news.
Also just because they were responsible about their dick move doesn’t mean everybody will be. Or something happens that causes long term damage by accident.
I care for environment greatly but I’d slap these people as long as I could lift my hands and then some.
They are basically 5th columning environmental causes when they do shit like this.
At least someone is doing something. The governments are way to slow imho. Also, there is literally no harm done. So everybody hyperventilating in the comments should maybe calm down a little.
They’re not doing anything except virtue signalling.
What did you do during the climate crisis, grandpa? Did you canvass politicians? Did you install solar panels? Did you vote for the green party? Did you blockade drilling sites? Did you run for Parliament?
No Jimmy I sprayed paint on some old rocks
May as well stay at home and stab yourself in the head with a fork until you black out.
What have you done against the climate crisis?
Well so far I’ve painted all the rocks in my garden neon yellow, so I’ve done about the same as those twats.
Oh, and also all the things I mentioned in my previous post (except run for Parliament), so there is that.
Doesn’t actually take that much fucking effort. I can’t guarantee that my actions will have definite results, but what I can say for sure is that at least I’m doing things that are actually targeted at fixing the problem and not just getting attention so that a bunch of useless wankers can feel self-righteous.
Certainly my solar panels will contribute something at least.
So, what have you done?
lmao keep complaining and sitting on your lazy ass
That will teach those neolithic druids to think about their long term impact on the planet!
I’m all for peaceful environmental protesting, but destruction of property and historic monuments/items only makes your movement look worse. News will spin it as the protesters being vandals and go about their day. Most people won’t think beyond that and will probably associate environmental activism with negative things such as vandalism or whatever else their favorite news calls what they’re doing.
Powder, its quite likely water soluble
Yup, its starch based and water soluble. It’ll come off with a little water, no harm done.
There’s no need for the media to spin anything, the protestors committed vandalism and, unless they are protesting the existence of prehistoric monuments, they did a really shitty job of even calling attention to their cause.
Climate protesters seem to have a knack for doing really irrelevant shit to bring attention to climate change.
No one dies? No one loses their balls? No beatings?
Is the planet dying or not? If so wtf is powder paint gonna do except fuck it up more???
it’s the only way they can get the news to engage with it
Why Stonehenge? What does Stonehenge have to do with climate change?
Maybe go sink some yachts or spray paint some Saudi oil dealers.
They are doing it to get attention. Because there is not enough attention on climate change.
Look at the raging reactions in the comments to a little bit of starch. If they would actually destroy something, let alone hurt someone, they’d be framed as terrorists and prosecuted in a heartbeat.
People will use this to galvanize efforts against climate action, and it will work. If you want to seriously do something, go after the people causing the crisis.
Cool. How?
Do crimes
How is that gonna help?
It will inspire people to take more drastic action, and highlight the urgency of the cause in a way that targets those who are causing it. It’s also more likely to create sympathy, since the ones causing the problem are the ones being punished for it.
The climate crisis is not caused by certain individuals.
Policy is what drives the climate crisis, and policy is primarily controlled by the rich and powerful, especially in countries like the US where corporate lobbying reigns supreme. You could argue that it’s ultimately capitalist incentives that create this paradigm, but I would say that those incentives are upheld by the same powerful individuals who benefit from them.
tl;dr, the climate crisis is caused by certain individuals.
the whole “the climate crisis isn’t the fault of people” is an excuse for the religious and rich and stupid to continue with business as usual until the environment collapses and we are all dead
reasoning with them is like trying to de-program a cult member (the religious), get a drug addict to give up drugs (the rich and their avarice), or teach a windows user to learn linux (the stupid and learning new things that make sense)
the intelligent people need to stop trying to reason with these three tar pit groups and force them to adhere to our will
but the reality is that this should have happened 50 to 100 years ago and it’s probably too late. we’re sort of of at the “is it better to be in the blast zne or slightly outside the blast zne” phase of environmental collapse. the problem is mostly religion, which has doomed us.
Activists (try to) do that as well. But it’s much harder to get close to a rich person or their property, than it is to do something in public spaces. They, too, have to see what they can do with their limited resources.
Next, the media coverage is very unequal, as well as reader’s interest. You are much more likely to click on an article covering a potentially outrageous action, than you are to read about something which does not bother anyone. Although you can rest assured, these things are tried and done frequently.
So naturally, to the uninvolved reader, it may seem as if activists don’t do anything but stupid stunts. And naturally, each outsider seems to think they have a much better grasp of strategy and what actions might make sense than the people who are actually involved in these things.
Of course, a particular action can still be silly. I just want to draw attention to biases at play, in general.
And if you really have a much better idea how to do something about the climate crisis, then go ahead and shine as an example. Not only would you author an actually impactful action (which in itself should be reason enough), you could also show all these rookie activists how to get things done. If your example is convincing, you should see less media coverage about inferior actions.
It’s particularly funny because Stonehenge is almost entirely a reconstruction and not a partially destructive one at that. Iirc there are even legit photos of the henge stones in piles on the ground.
Ed: you can down vote but it’s true, it’s been continually knocked down and rebuilt throughout its history.
The motion to run around punching mothers in the face lost out to this.
Srs, these ‘activists’ are fucking up by being shitheads. I hate them.
Yeah yeah it supposedly washes off, i get it. It’s still really stupid.
How so?
If the idea is to get people talking about their ideology, then we can be sure it’s worked.
I support this.
The only thing people are talking about is what assholes they are. If they didn’t have a description in their name no one would even know what they wanted.
Hey if this is working for you, watch what happens when we piss in the produce aisle! People will really get the message then! Probably. We should call ourselves “Pissing in the Produce Aisle to Stop Oil” though, just so it’s clear.
When you attack Stonehenge I’m not listening to what your ideology is. Because all I see is you being a jackass. Attacking works of arts or in this case Stonehenge to me looks like a child in a restaurant yelling and screaming that they want a cookie. I’m not going to give in to the demands of the child just because they’re loud. You’ll notice I don’t talk about the ideologies, I talk about their actions, so it didn’t work.
Oh no! The history that we could have all have enjoyed in the future (if we weren’t all about to die due to environmental collapse) has been slightly marred!
because they’re not a vigilante justice organisation they just want the media to talk about it
Good.
