What are the most privacy respecting smartphones to buy, I am also looking for the one which respects your privacy the most. So far going to privacy communities esp on reddit, I often see Google Pixel + GrapheneOS being recommended.
But the thing is I don’t really trust Google with privacy, as we have seen they are last one to respect privacy. What if Google has some backdoor in the hardware that cannot be changed? And the problem with the more privacy respecting OSes for mobiles like GrapheneOS, CalyxOS etc are that they are only supported for Google pixel phones.
So I am really confused here.
Google Pixels have no backdoors. Recently, Maxime Rossi Bellom , Philippe Teuwen and Damiano Melotti did a deep research about the Google’s Chip, called TITAN M, in order to give an understanding regard it’s attack surface as well as the known and previously vulnerabilities.
Presentation Material
There is also a repository on GitHub, which contains the tools they used in their research on the Google Titan M chip.
There is also a very interesting thread from Daniel Cuthbert, in which he showed some part about their presention. In the same thread, he also wrote that the Titan M is the reason why he switch from iPhone to Pixel.
We’re are talking about BlackHat here, not some random guy which claims things without any proof.
Regard the OS, GrapheneOS is far better than CalyxOS; it offers much better privacy and security improvements. You can see the list of the features here; https://grapheneos.org/features
This is interesting to hear. So research finds no presence of any backdoors on the TITAN M chips of Google pixel phones. I wanted to buy a new smartphone which is more private and so far the most private OSes are only supported for pixel phones. On a sidenote, how does the GrapheneOS compare to other OSes like the LineageOS or DivestOS?
I don’t know about DivestOS. However, GrapheneOS is dramatically better than LineageOS. That’s because GrapheneOS is focused on privacy and security rather than customization like LineageOS. GrapheneOS starts from the strong baseline of the Android security model and brings a lot of privacy and security improvements. While LineageOS doesn’t have real privacy and security improvements, it also weakens the android security model.
There is a very good article written by madaidan, who explain the security of Android and the problems about lineageOS; https://madaidans-insecurities.github.io/android.html
Thanks. DivestOS is a fork of LineageOS. Website: https://divestos.org/
Madaidan’s article also seems to recommend Pixel + GrapheneOS. Would there be any significant difference between Pixel 3, 4 or 5 when it comes to privacy? Asking since, Pixel 5 costs more than 4 and 3 and whether it would be worth paying an extra hundreds of dollars for the latest Pixel.
Hi! Really sorry for the delay.
Every new generation of pixel bring privacy and security improvements hardware wise. In particular, the new pixels have set a new standard for mobile security;
https://security.googleblog.com/2021/10/pixel-6-setting-new-standard-for-mobile.html
This article smells bullshit.
Having a separate chip for some system activity is reasonable security, but what about running a libre GSM modem with some clear (hardware) limits on what it can reach in case it’s compromised (this is what Pinephone/Librem is doing)?
Encouraging fingerprints as passwords. Worst security advice ever.
Built-in protections automatically scan for potential threats from phone calls, text messages, emails, and links sent through apps, notifying you if there’s a potential problem. (…) The detection runs on your Pixel, and uses a privacy preserving technology called federated analytics to discover commonly-run bad apps.
I don’t know about the details, but this smells like some really privacy-invasive tech.
I hear lots of great things about Graphene but it’s only able to run on Pixel phones. I have a LineageOS installed on my phone & I have full control over the firewall, and there’s no google on it. Got the phone a year ago, battery still lasts 2 days of occasional use. It’s amazing how nice a phone feels without ads, constant upload/download, and unneeded background services running.
Basically, and even with Graphene, the biggest security risk for a phone is the person using it. I wish it were more turn-key but the tracking with cookies is just the tip of the iceburg… apps like to track too and if you need an app outside of the free-open-source-software circle you should know how to control its access to the internet.
Yeah thats about right. If you stat worrying about hardware backdoors then you should go with a pinephone. Personally im not that worried about hardware backdoors as theyre probably everywhere so i use a samsung with LineageOS, up to you to choose
Either Pinephone or Pixel + GrapheneOS are the way to go?
On my opinion yeah, id go with pixel if you want your phone to be usable
GrapheneOS is a highly problematic ROM with a lot of security grift. Their community is extremely toxic, racist, disgusting and refuse technical help via a combination of lots of gatekeeping and technical elitism. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dx7CZ-2Bajg
The developer is a one man show who acts like a dictator and exclusively claims Google Pixels are the only phones he will ever support. Why? https://unddit.com/r/privacytoolsIO/comments/gs4uv7/i_dont_fully_trust_grapheneos/fs82fdv/
GrapheneOS also takes some rather controversial stances regarding the protection of its users, a lot of whom have a high threat model. https://teddit.net/r/privacytoolsIO/comments/pjl4bh/what_is_your_opinion_of_grapheneos_conforming_to/
There are a few malicious actors and proponents of this community that attack everyone like an unorganized group, sometimes with sockpuppets and sometimes with their known accounts when they want to come off as self proclaimed experts.
A lot of evidence I collected personally via my own interactions with madaidan, cn3m and the likes: https://lemmy.ml/post/73800/comment/66676
Evidence of GrapheneOS proponents practicing censorship on Lemmy on my comment on c/GrapheneOS, one day after they became moderator (FYI this was my only comment on that sublemmy): https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/3hsM7Du9n6.jpg
They have also hijacked the Android, AOSP sublemmy communities by becoming defunct moderators.
Sorry for a late reply. The grapheneOS seems to have a problem with not a very welcoming community but their OS is still good with all the security and privacy features that it comes with? If it is not Google Pixel + GrapheneOS that is the most private way of using a mobile phone then what is the most private way? I see this set up recommended in almost every privacy community including this thread.
A lot of these people are either sockpuppets or members of GrapheneOS, NoGoolag or SpiteChat Telegram/Matrix rooms that create a narrative to hijack the privacy communities. And it would not be surprising to conclude that they are a menace, because they encourage technical elitism quite a lot, and all of the other problems mentioned above.
GrapheneOS moderators practicing censorship on Lemmy is not going to look the best either, but here we are. I have engaged with these people for probably 2-3 years, so I am about as experienced as one gets.
You could check this resource I made for a smartphone guide https://lemmy.ml/post/54596 or https://teddit.net/r/privatelife/comments/lpyl1s/
can’t you stick to the OS and hardware (facts) and leave politics/opinions outta this? the community does matter if you need help, but how in the hell do they know your race, sex, or politics unless you wear them on your sleeve?
You know, what you call politics only tells about your indecency as regards with how communities are run. And whoever calls assholery a mere form of political whining tells a lot about them. Nobody likes assholes, period. And nobody wants to worship one.
Facts do not care about feelings, so you can just stop feeling about others’ feelings towards your lack of decency, and you can enjoy your technical supremacy, if you really think you are so highly meritorious and if that gives you the right to trample on others.
My rights end where yours begin and vice versa. My main point will always be “you do you” or “good fences make good neighbours” or don’t trespass on my property or in my mental space. Values differ from individual to individual - even within close-knit families or within causes. As long as you don’t infringe upon another’s freedom (I include all animals - wild and domestic), you should be able to do as you please. Both Left and Right have one thing in common - both try to shove their values (“decency”) down the throats of others. Fuck you both equally. If that (do as I say) mindset isn’t offensive, then i don’t know what is! Be as this or that as you like, but preaching to me when I don’t wanna hear it is going to breed resentment. That is you wasting my time and mental energies. Live by your own values and if I see that you are content, healthy, and successful in one manner or another, maybe I will adopt some of your ways WITHOUT your saying one word to me. Proselytizing or ‘teaching’ me is so often rude.
Both Left and Right have one thing in common - both try to shove their values (“decency”) down the throats of others. Fuck you both equally.
Well, then indecency will not be spared either. You already resent decency, since you already decided your stance, and have decided that any discussion is going to result in you saying “fuck you” to anyone that does.
You are also wasting your time when you say calling out GrapheneOS community is political whining, when it is not, and if it is, then it makes you the same, because you are complaining about feelings when you ask me to stop caring about some politically motivated understanding or feelings. It is hypocritical.
Right and wrong are relative to some extent and always have been and always will be. Who is to say the religious fundamentalist’s ‘decency’ is better or worse than (the obvious opposite) a Progressive’s? Who is sole arbiter of the truth? Shouldn’t it be more up to the individual? What ever happened to “Live and let live”?
Who is to say the religious fundamentalist’s ‘decency’ is better or worse than (the obvious opposite) a Progressive’s? Who is sole arbiter of the truth?
I see these arguments from modern day fascists and /pol/ users all the time. This is a classic grift technique to make themselves look balanced and somehow try to place the onus of morality on an entity that does not exist, and so they themselves can look more balanced instead of the extremists that they are.
Your history, your above comments and your obsession to reply even after 18 days reveals enough about your interests, so forget about convincing me regarding your holier than thou arguments.
Anyway, downvoting my comments will not make a difference. The moment I see something that goes against Lemmy rules or the rules for this sublemmy, I will take action in accordance.
The question is “which smartphones are most private?” Not “which OS community is the least toxic?” Seems you have your reasons for hating on Graphene, but you’ve totally lost the plot here. Save that rant for a question thats actually asking about it, please. In the end, if it works and its the most private, thats what is going to matter the most to the end user.
GrapheneOS community is terrible if you want help from them. It is a place filled with faux elitists with 4chan and reddit tier knowledge, and will use buzzwords to impress you, with non existent explanations when asked for. If you want to use it, go ahead. But if you want to enter a landmine expecting any guidance, good luck.
Many people have been driven away from that community and ROM for plenty reasons I laid out in parent comment. People learn only via 2 ways - they learn from others’ experiences or they experience it themselves and then learn. You can make your choice.
